Dr. Debby Stroman: Welcome to, “If You Only Knew”, with Dr. Debby Stroman and what a day it is. Virginia basketball, athletics, sports, with two wonderful, wonderful people. With coach Mike Huff and with his son, Jay Huff. So I want to start off with you, Mike. This is definitely a family affair. Tell us where it all started for you first off, like what brought you to sports and what sports got you motivated to stick with it your entire career?

Mike Huff: Well, I grew up in a tiny town in Eastern Washington state, 300 people in the town.  And so, in those kinds of towns, first of all, you gotta play sports or there’s not enough to have a team, but my earliest memory is my dad had a little drug store there and had a little gift shop and everything.

And I remember him bringing me home a basketball. And we had, well, first we’ve actually lived above the store and we just had a fence and I put a ring around the fence when I was real little and we would throw the ball in the ring, but we finally moved to a house with a, an actual court. And my dad brought home this ball, and I just spent hours out on the court, just dribbling and shooting and hucking it up cause I was too little to get it up there.

But, I just couldn’t stop. And then there’d be wiffle ball in the yard or there’d be, and it just depended on what season it was. And we swam in the summertime. And so sports was really always there for me. Basketball was the greatest passion, but I played quarterback and football, I pitched in baseball, and, you kind of had the whole–  plus had to do drama and everything else in a town like that. Play in the band and so we did it all in my little town.

Jay Huff: He was multitalented and typically you seem to be the throwing guy in whatever sport you were in.

Mike Huff: Yes.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Awesome. Now I have to ask what instrument?

Mike Huff: Trombone.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Okay.

Mike Huff: I played a little piano when I was young, but I quit because I loved sports, but then we got to high school and, again, it was like everybody, you got to do a little bit of everything. So I joined the band and played the trombone and enjoyed that too.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well, excellent. So, any sport do-overs or particular highlights in your career as an athlete?

Mike Huff: That’s a great question. I was thinking about that. And I think if it were to be a do-over, I would say, just to fully commit myself at a young age to really understand what that meant and to train and to just really focus on it, because I think what I always tell my guys when I’m coaching is, “I have a lot of potential, but, but the greatest regret in life is unfulfilled potential.”

And so that’s what I always try to communicate to them is that don’t leave anything back where you’re going to have regrets, put everything you have into it, and then you have no regrets. As far as highlights, for a guy who grew up in a town like I did to have played college basketball, and then to have traveled the world, I’ve been all over this country. I’ve been to Australia twice. I’ve been to England and Ireland and Wales and all other countries, just because I played or coached basketball. And that’s a pretty, pretty amazing thing that a sport can do for you.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well, there’s no doubt it is. It’s been awesome. It is. And, so glad that young people are still motivated to get involved with sports, but we know there are some challenges today, but I want to transition to Jay. So was basketball your first love? Cause clearly you have the genes between your mom and your dad to be an athlete, but tell us about your entree into basketball and the other sports.

Jay Huff: I’d say basketball is definitely my first. Yeah. Like you said, my first love sports-wise, I think when I was really young, I just enjoyed playing no matter what it was, I just, I wanted to be playing outside, running around. Basketball was the sport that I was best at both due to the genetics and the skills I got from my parents. And then also the fact that I was,  six-five back then, I think.  So it was, I would definitely say that it was, but I also played a lot of other sports at the same time. So it was, it was good.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Now, when did you realize that basketball was going to be the sport in high school and obviously college at the University of Virginia?

Jay Huff: I think middle school is around the time that I knew that I wanted to, like, stick with basketball despite, still playing other sports. But those, at that point, it became more of like a cross-training exercise.

Like soccer, I played largely to work on footwork, conditioning, that type of thing. Track, swimming, were kind of the same, just good exercises that I could do and that I enjoyed as well. But, most of them tied somehow to helping with basketball stuff. And then once I got to high school, I just decided to stick with basketball. My Junior year was when I started getting recruited by coaches other than, I think, one or two D3 schools that recruited me early on. But, Junior year was around the time I was like, “Oh man, like this might actually work out and I might be able to make it big, like to a big ACC school. So.

Mike Huff: I was just going to jump in with my background in sports training and things like that. I’m a big multi-sport guy. And if you look in, in the professional leagues, most guys played multiple sports in high school. They didn’t start focusing really early. So we always encouraged Jay to play multiple sports. And it wasn’t until as a Freshman that he came to me and said, “Dad, I want to really just focus on basketball”, that we ever even considered just playing one sport.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well, that’s certainly my background as well. So I’m glad you mentioned that, that it is interesting to watch how young people today are asked to specialize at an early age.

Mike Huff: That’s crazy.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well, I believe that cross-training and developing those muscles and the brain, right. The intelligence and how to perform different skills and how that helps us when we finally specialize when we get older. So Jay, outside of your parents, and I know they were so, so influential in your life academically, athletically, who else influenced you in terms of particular teachers or mentors or other coaches?

Jay Huff: I’d say one of my biggest mentors throughout the course of my life, especially Midland high school, was my youth pastor, Brad. I still to this day, keep in touch with him. He helped officiate my wedding and he’s just, he’s a guy that I’ve always looked to for advice on any number of topics, just because he’s always got an interesting perspective.

He thinks very differently. And he’s as a Christian and as a man of faith, he sees the world from a very unique perspective that I typically appreciate.  So it’s, he’s definitely been someone that’s had a big influence on me. A lot of other coaches, Andy Pogach, he was my travel team coach along with my dad.

My dad was the assistant coach for that team, the Carolina Flyers. Yeah, I mean just a lot, a lot of friends too. I have. A lot of friends that I still keep in touch with from Durham to this day that have influenced me and kept in touch and just then people that I look to as good people.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well, that’s a great formula. I always tell my students, “It’s not what you know, it’s not who you know, it’s who knows you on a favorable basis”, which basically means that you have to have quality relationships where you’re not just taking, taking, taking, but you’re a giver as well.

Jay Huff: Absolutely.

Dr. Debby Stroman: So Mike, let’s transition to you in terms of what you’re doing now. And so I know you’ve touched a lot of people as an educator, as a coach. Tell us a little bit more about what you’re doing in your life.

Mike Huff: Well, I’m still teaching at the same school where Jay went, when he got to the point where he was going to start getting some serious playing time, I stepped down from the coaching aspect, which is the part that I really love, but I’m still involved in education and trying to help young people grow.

I’m a physical education teacher.  Then I also do from time to time, a little individual basketball training, run a camp at our school. There’s an organization that’s been very influential in my life called NBC Camps. And we were actually running the North Carolina site of that camp in the summertime.

So that’s been a real joy to be able to do that. And then just trying to be a good dad, good husband , good friend. And, it’s a little tough in these COVID times to be out there doing too much, but, sometimes I feel like I need to be out there doing a little bit more.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well–

Jay Huff: He does do a good job being a dad.

Dr. Debby Stroman: That’s right. Thank you, Jay for that. I wanted to also illuminate that it’s wonderful to be a parent that can support your child because we know, in Jay, you think about your years at UVA, they go by so fast and to be able to have your family and friends watch you and support you and cheer for you. And I’ve been very blessed to sit next to your parents through their very, very wonderful kindness and see how they encourage you and how oftentimes not often, because you know, coaches don’t want you to looking up in the stands, but seeing that relationship that you have, where you can just do the nod or, you know, you can, you can, I guess it’s the DNA. You all are speaking to each other in a way, just because you’re so connected.

Jay Huff: Yeah.

Mike Huff:  And I don’t want to also forget to mention that I’m involved with this group called the Center for Sport Business and Analytics.

Jay Huff: Nice save. Nice save.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Great, you are. Having the Center of Sport Business and Analytics and having you Mike is definitely a blessing for all that you offer in all of your experiences and knowledge. It’s so, so important. And so you mentioned COVID. COVID 19. This is a pandemic that certainly has had a big effect on sports.

Now, people believe that sports is that stress reliever for, for many people and I think that’s true, but also we have to think about the participants in the gate. And so, Jay, I want to ask you about how you’re adapting, how you’re able to cope during this time period, being an elite athlete, and yet understanding that things aren’t normal. How are you holding up?

Jay Huff: Yeah.  I’m doing well. I mean, all things considered, I’d say I’m doing well. I think there are times where it gets difficult. I’ve definitely developed into more of a home-body during this time.  Actually, I recently got married and so, me and my wife, Lindsay, she just walked out, unfortunately, but I guess she won’t hear me brag on her.

That stinks, but she’s been great through all of it. She’s been really just a blessing to have around. And she has to deal with the fact that I have to be pretty isolated. I can’t really go see a lot of people. Most of my friends graduated anyways, the friends that weren’t on the basketball team.

So it’s not like I have a ton of people around here anyways, that I would want to go see, but there’s a few people that I still know and it’s hard cause I, I have to find times and like find ways to be able to go see people. And she’s got to find ways to do that within the restrictions that we have. And that’s been hard.

We’ve had to definitely figure that out, but she’s been really great through all of it. But yeah, I’ve definitely  become a home-body and not really, I don’t really leave the apartment much. I go to the apartment gym, back here, got into ordering food a lot, which is dangerous. So, yeah. Doing okay.

Mike Huff: Talk about some of the training you did over the summer though, Jay. Since you weren’t able to get in the gym so much.

Jay Huff: Yeah. So,  I just, I tried to find a lot of ways and my dad helped me a lot. Just finding things to do that were good exercises, good workout activities that weren’t necessarily lifting weights because we didn’t have access to a weight room. A lot of times we couldn’t even find a gym. So I took the time to try to just get strong in whatever way I could. So it was, it was an interesting mix. I did some yoga with my wife who was my fiance at the time. And then we put, we hung up a punching bag in the garage, which we actually used that a fair amount. I would like to use it more. Unfortunately, I’m not there so Dad I hope you’re getting some good use out of it.

Mike Huff: I am.

Jay Huff: Love it. And my favorite activity personally from the summer was I got into wood chopping. We bought an ax and a splitter and we, at one point had taken down a tree in our yard that was, I guess it was going to fall or something like that.

And so we just decided to take it down. And I had a bunch of stumps that I chopped through over the course of the summer. And then I ended up when we had to come back for summer school and everything like that, I brought a big stump that my dad, my dad, and I actually stole this stump from a, a golf course near our house.

We stole a bunch of stumps just because we were running out of wood to chop. Don’t tell the golf course. But, we still, yeah, so we got rid of some of the stumps for them. I think we still have some in the backyard that double as stools now. And so I brought one with me and I brought an ax and I would just take it out into the grass near the dorm that we were staying at at the time. And I would chop, just chop for a while and splinters would be flying everywhere and I’d try to get the big chunks, but —

Dr. Debby Stroman: No, this is great. Wow. I’m thinking about all the trees in my yard and I’m thinking about having some taken down, so I might  have to call the Huffs.

Jay Huff: Hey, feel free. That would be, that would be awesome. I would love to do that and get some use out of my truck. I feel like I haven’t really, really used it very much recently.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Alright, don’t be surprised I might call you. Now, the other thing is the calisthenics, right? Mike, we know this is what, Jack Lalane. This is what we used to do when we didn’t have all this equipment, we would just do things to give us strength using our own natural body weight. So that’s great. You’ve gone back to old school. This is how we trained when we were younger.

Jay Huff: Yeah. I mean, there’s no reason that you have to have all the equipment in order to train.

Dr. Debby Stroman: That’ts right.

Jay Huff: I mean, obviously there’s running and stuff. You can find a hill, but chopping wood is conditioning in and of itself. I mean, you take a few swings and especially if you haven’t done it before you get winded pretty quickly, and then you can build it up to try to just chop as quickly as you can, or just try to get through a stack of wood. I mean, it’s a workout. The day after I did it the first time , I didn’t want to move very much. I was, I was pretty beat. So I would highly recommend it.

Excellent. Thank you. Mike, any advice to young people? How do you stay positive? How do you stay motivated in a pandemic?

Mike Huff: Well, obviously it’s tough, but I think what makes it tough as if you don’t get out,  get outside some, and then the kids, like anything else, you have to focus on what you can control and not on what you can’t control.

So we can’t control that we’re in a pandemic and can’t go to school and can’t do that. But you can control the fact that you can get outside and dribble a basketball or run, like the hill, or chop the wood or do something physical. So you really have to focus on that and it is a chance to develop just the athleticism.

Maybe you don’t have as much chance to work on your skills if you don’t have a hoop in your yard or you’re not playing against your friends or whatever, but there’s always something that you can do. And so you can’t just allow yourself to binge watch TV shows or eat the junk in the  refrigerator because you’re not going to come out of this in a better place.

I can’t remember who it was that, the coach that I talked about. He talked about winning the pandemic, you got to win the pandemic. Who’s going to come out on the other side of it, having improved in the most , versus just, “ugh I can’t do anything.”  No, you gotta, it takes a lot of focus, a lot of self-discipline and just every day.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Go ahead, Jay. What would you say to young people?

Jay Huff: I think to tack onto that, I see a lot of kids and like high school students, especially, they post pictures and videos of themselves working out in a gym,  or lifting weights and stuff like that. And it’s like, you might not be able to do all that now. I personally think that’s silly.

Like you should just be able to get into gym and do your work and get out. You don’t need to have a photographer, but that’s beside the point.  Like just the outdoor workouts and stuff, you can look back later on and see all the work that you did when there wasn’t much, you didn’t have many resources.

And I think you can use that as motivation to be able to look back and say, “Hey, I did something when there wasn’t much to be done.”

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well, thanks for that great advice. I definitely agree. Avoid that bingeing. I’m watching some really great stuff, but I also have enjoyed my bicycle. I have an electric bike and I know some of my friends are like, “Oh, you’re cheating”, but you actually have to pedal. And when I think about the workout that I’m getting, I mean, it has been amazing. I love my bicycle and I am in Chapel Hill where there are lots of hills.

Jay Huff:  Yeah. I was going to say, dang.

Dr. Debby Stroman: No, it’s great. Alright, so there is another pandemic and this one’s been going on for more than 400 years. We’re talking about racism and certainly athletics. Sports has been deeply deeply connected. And especially right now, when we have so many prominent athletes and coaches and sport administrators talking about these inequities. And so I want to start with you, Mike, what are your thoughts? What can we do to move forward? Are there any particular activist athletes that you admire for their work in this space?

Mike Huff: Yeah, I think to me it just hurts my heart every time I think about it. And I know after one of the more recent incidents, I called you because you had talked to me about a seminar which I then actually went through and I’ve been reading a lot.

And you know, when you look online, there was, I looked at this site, it just detailed all of lynchings that had occurred over the years and you know, all these kinds of things. It’s just like, why, why? I really don’t understand it. And I read a book called, “Oneness Embraced” by Tony Evans who’s a pastor in Dallas. Who’s one of the guys that I really admire and I think just trying to, again, what can we control? We can control the relationships that we have, and trying to make the most of those, and then trying to stand up against it or speak out against it when we have the opportunities.

And so one of the people that I’ve really admired and one of my, one of my regrets for Jay being at UVA is he got there one year too late and didn’t get to play with a guy named Malcolm Brogdon. And Malcolm has done a lot of great work, just in terms of humanity, in terms of water and countries in Africa and things like that.

But he was one of the first ones to speak out. And was out there on the front lines. And, I just think he’s a really incredible person that I wish so much that Jay would have had a chance to be under his leadership for a year, but we’ve admired him for a long time. And then I was thinking about it too.

The, not an athlete, but a person in the, in that space is the guy who recruited Jay to UVA. A guy named Ron Sanchez. And Ron is now the head coach at UNC Charlotte. And just to tell a story about Ron and this is a little bit more personal, but I have a friend whose son made a terrible, terrible mistake that really didn’t reflect who he was.

But in this world of social media, you can put something out there and it can have a big effect. And he without going into any details, made a serious social media blunder in the world of social justice or just relationships and it cost him. It cost him athletically, his family was under tremendous pressure, they almost had to move.

And I talked and it’s in the Charlotte area. And so I talked to Ron about it. And Ron actually reached out to my friend who’s white and it meant so much to him to have Ron reach out like that. And so I just think Ron is an incredible person and I actually last night was listening to an interview that he did with Tom Rinaldi as part of the speaker series at UNC Charlotte.

One of the things that I remember him talking about was how he encourages his players to actually do something. He said that, “Tweeting and putting stuff on social media is not acting.”  So he’s really encouraging his guys to act and to be part of change. And I just have so much admiration from him. I mean, from the first minute I ever met him, I could tell there was something special about him, again, as you think about regrets, he left UVA. And so we were excited for him to have that opportunity, but, just to have Jay being around him was a pretty special thing for a couple of years and I wish it would have lasted longer.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well, you certainly lifted up two very, very wonderful gentlemen, Malcolm and Ron, yes, definitely support that. And you ask the question,”why?” Why, why, why?  I think about the research. 13 year study, $2.7 billion, the human genome project that said we are 99.98% alike. And in fact, I love what this very prominent anthropologist said that, “we aren’t first cousins, we aren’t second cousins, were somewhere between 45 and 50.” And I wish we could remember that when we see each other, but sadly, when we see someone and we do see race within milliseconds, that’s what the research says. So you can’t walk around saying, “Oh, I don’t see color.” That’s absurd. It’s impossible.

Mike Huff: No, and I think, yeah. And so one of the things with reading Tony Evans and reading a lot of stuff is, when we get to heaven, the Bible talks about it being people of every nation and every creed and every color and that’s what God’s kingdom is meant to be. And so there’s no reason for us on the basis of race or anything else to be saying that you’re less than me or anything. When all this started happening, I just thought about all the African-American people in my life that I’m just so thankful for. And it just, how I remember talking to my friend who lives in Spokane, Washington, who’s an African-American guy in one of the more white parts of the world, and, he said still to this day, and he’s a guy who is so friendly and such a good person.

And he says he has people who, in his neighborhood who won’t speak to him and he just can’t understand why and it’s hard and I don’t understand why either because it, it just, it’s not, it makes no sense. And it just saddens me.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Jay, you want to jump in here?

Jay Huff: Yeah. Yeah. I mean, similar to what dad said, coach Sanchez is just one of the best people I know and someone that I’m really thankful for and someone like the way he talked about,  doing something. I think that’s huge.  Coach Wilford, another one of our coaches. He was out speaking at a, an event like, like my dad said on the front lines. And so I think that’s one of the good things that our coaches are about.

And even coach Sanchez, who’s no longer there, but he was still like that.  It’s that they’re about action. They’re not people that will just say something and then not follow through with it. And same with coach Bennett, even like, they’re all, they’re all about doing something and not just  talking about it.

So I think that’s huge. I try to avoid posting too much on social media, even if it’s stuff that a lot of people are talking about, like a lot of these race issues, just because I haven’t quite figured it out yet, but I think it’s because I want to be more about relationships than about putting something out there.

So when things started happening, I just tried to reach out to some of my friends and just like, “Hey, what do you need from me?” Some of my friends even wanted me to help them get their message across. And an old teammate of mine, he would send me stuff on Instagram and I would send that out because he’s someone that I really trust and really believe, has a great heart and knows what he’s talking about and has experiences that I’ve never experienced.

I would have him send me stuff that he was doing. He was also out on the front lines in Durham.  It was really cool to see and like to hear what he was saying and talking to people at these events. And it was, it was just a really cool thing. Really praying that he’s continuing. I’m sure he’s continuing to do work, but I’m just, I’m praying that he’s maintaining good mental health because I know that’s hard and that took a toll on him.

It’s still hard when we have conversations with the team. We’ve had some zoom calls where we just talk about some of the things that were happening just talking about events that have occurred and like how we feel about them or like how African-American teammates of mine, what their experiences have been.

Because I honestly don’t know a lot about that. There was an instance that I don’t even know if I’ve told you about this. But I was, I was driving. This was right when we got back for summer school and I I’ve been trying to be very cautious. I have, I don’t really let people in my car other than my wife.

But I have a truck, so I have teammates or if it’s like a short drive, I can like drive them from A to B in the bed of the truck. And we get to where we’re going. We get to the dorm and he tells me that the car behind us had yelled, a slur, basically, that I did not hear. My windows were up. But I was, it’s just sad because it just makes no sense.

There’s no reason for that. And it, it kinda opened my eyes just to the fact that there’s a lot of ignorant people, even in the surrounding like Charlottesville area, because Charlottesville is a place where you don’t really expect that. At least I don’t.  I tend to think that it’s a pretty welcoming place, but hearing that was incredibly disappointing.

And if I had seen the car, then I might’ve had to follow them. I don’t know what I would have done, but it’s just, it just makes me really angry because like my dad said, I have a lot of African-American people in my life that I’m really thankful for. And anybody that does stuff or comes after them, it’s not right.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well, I appreciate what you stated and especially you’re helping your friend by using your platform. I’m not a big fan of the word ally. I think that what that can imply is that you’re working behind or beside, and we need more than ever conscious white people to speak to white people. And so I say, “allied leader.” Because certainly the crazies are speaking to white people.

We need more conscious white people to speak to white people, but by using your platform, that is an example of what white people can do to help. And so I thank you for that. When you also mentioned UVA being a historically white institution in the South with all of that, that goes along with that.

I feel very blessed to be a part of university’s racial equity report that was released. That’s creating a lot of buzz all across the United States because it was so bold in the sense that we can do better. And when we bring people together, diverse backgrounds and thoughts around race and racism in this country that we can put something together that we can actually take action upon.

And so I thank you for that leadership and thank you for your comments. And so, when it’s all over, when it’s all over, when the two of you are sitting back in your rocking chair and watching your favorite teams, what do you want to be known for? We’ll start with you, Mike, what do you want to be known for?

Mike Huff: Well, when I used to, when I was coaching,  I remember reading a book by a guy named Bart Ehrman, who was a football coach. And,  people would ask him , “how do you know that you’re successful?” And he would say that, “I don’t know. I won’t know for about 20 years.” And so what you really, your success is not so much we won a state championship, so we were successful.

Well, 20 years down the road, are those guys who played on that team, are they good people? Are they leaders? Are they good husbands and dads and running businesses and doing those kinds of things because if they’re doing that and we had any part in that, then that is success. So, I think trophy cases are nice, but I walk by that state tournament, state championship trophy all the time and don’t notice it now. But what you notice is the guys. That I would love to be in the room with that group of guys. Those are the trophies.

And so when I look back on it, sitting in that rocking chair, I just want to be able to see that those guys are doing well and that their experience playing basketball for me, while at times it was tough, I know they’ll tell you, I’m probably not the easiest coach in the world to play for. But, I hopefully would also tell, and they would understand how much that I love them and that my being tough on them, my challenging them was part of helping them to, to be their best. And maybe looking back at my life, like I talked about and, and unfulfilled potential and not wanting them to have that same experience.

So to be able to look back and see guys who’ve gone on and been successful and reach their potential. That’s, that’s really what it’s all about.

Dr. Debby Stroman: That is wonderful. Seeing the fruit, the fruit of the labor. Jay, what do you want to be remembered for and your youthfulness?

Jay Huff: Yeah, I mean, my dad kind of took a lot of what I would have said as well. Basketball is what it is. It’s a game that I love. But at the end of the day, it is a game and it’s something that, looking back on my life when I’m old one day, I guess I feel like I’m getting pretty old now. My knees are feeling old, but that’s beside the point. I’d love to look back on my life and say, well, I loved every second of playing basketball.

That wasn’t the highlight of my life. I want to be known as like a good husband, a good father, hopefully,  I’m not, not anywhere that close yet. Dad, Don’t worry about that. But, a good friend, that’s really been one of my main goals in life is to just be a good friend. I have a teammate who is no longer on the team.

He decided to step away because he’s just got a lot of other interests. And basketball wasn’t really fulfilling him the way that music and finance and that type of thing would. And he was my best man at my wedding. And to this day, the memories of when he was on the team, it wasn’t the playing basketball that really stuck with me, but it was the nights where we would just go for a drive and listen to music and go get cookies from insomnia cookies down by the corner. And that we would just hang out together. It was those types of memories that really are gonna stick with me.

So basketball can come and go and I love it. But at the end of my life, I don’t think that– I want to be able to look back on basketball and think that those were like the glory days. I want it to be,  a fun part of my life, but I want to be remembered as a good husband, father, friend, and a Christian, somebody who made a difference in some people’s lives.

Dr. Debby Stroman: Well spoken like a true wahoo. That is indeed. It’s all about leadership, regardless of all of our endeavors and fun activities. We do that to develop our leadership. So I want to thank you very, very much. Coach Huff, I appreciate your friendship and your work with the center and Jay, I appreciate you. Your leadership on and off the court. You’ve been listening to “If You Only Knew” with Dr. Debby Stroman.