Don: One of the things I tell people is the reason I’m good at giving advice is I made a lot of mistakes and I’ve learned from those mistakes and kept pushing through. So I don’t come from a judgmental standpoint, it’s just, how do we learn, and can you learn from me? Can I learn from Jim? What are some of the lessons along the way as your career started to traject and grow that you would share with emerging entrepreneurs, emerging business people about reinventing yourself about chasing those goals and dreams about, right, how do you follow that, that purpose? 

Jim: Your audience is primarily probably startups and entrepreneurs, and I think it’s real important to establish as many relationships as possible because you never know who may be able to open the next door for you for that next opportunity.

And a lot of times we’re kind of tied in with these phones and our computers and, you know, social media and LinkedIn, but sometimes you really need to connect with people kind of face to face and let them know here’s what I’m doing, maybe they cannot help you right now, but maybe down the road, they can help you.

And you kind of want to have a process of checking in with someone every three, four months, because you just never know. And so I’ve had those kinds of opportunities, by checking in with people over time and they’ll say, hey, I was just thinking about you. And here’s something that I want you to consider.

And I just see that our, some of our younger entrepreneurs, they’re so focused on what they’re doing they never really look at it from the social interaction, personal relationship standpoint. I just think that’s something that’s critical.

Don: I will extend on that one, when I was doing the Donald Thompson Podcast early on before Earfluence, when I was just figuring out what a podcast was, I interviewed the folks at the Sport Shop. Erroll Reese and K Mac, and they said, and I’m going to extend what you described, your network is your net worth. And they talk just about what you were describing, that every relationship that you have is an opportunity to grow professionally and personally, but you don’t know where that seed’s going to come up, that you plant.

And so the way that you described it is super powerful because we do get trapped behind our keyboards, right? We do get focused on the thing that’s right in front of us and forget to cultivate those long-term relationships. And so I think that’s great, great advice. 

President of a bank. President of a historic, black owned bank, Durham, North Carolina. Tell a little bit about the M&F Bank story. 

Jim: It’s a great story. We’re actually celebrating 115 years in business this year. We’re the, we’re the second oldest African-American owned bank in the United States. The bank has, you know, you don’t have enough time for me to tell you all the history, but it has so much history that is actually unbelievable that I work here. 

I’m the 13th president of the institution. I came here in September of 2014. I didn’t know a soul in Durham. My father is from North Carolina, so I was familiar with North Carolina, but the, the history of it in terms of it started with nine founders with $10,000, had to get their bank charter from the state legislature back in 1907. I think how difficult that would be. They’ve been profitable 113 years out of 115 years. They actually had a streak of 108 straight years of profitability. That’s unheard of. the bank was founded on the principle to provide access to capital to small businesses and nonprofits and churches.

And it, it was always there to kind of help people and help the community. And so it just has such a rich history, that I’m exhilarated every day to go in there. Cause I just know that I’m standing on the shoulders of so many great presidents and boards of directors, but also, you know, the management team, who’s just built this up over time. but just, just happy to be there. And the bank is doing extremely well. 

Don: Oh man. That is powerful, and I’m getting chills a little bit because when I think about 1907 and I’m not a history buff, but I can put periods of time, to get a bank charter for a Black owned bank during that period of time, they met with some resistance. That right there, there were some, some back-channel things to hold them back. And so I’m always appreciative to learn the perseverance that we all stand on and we all can learn and appreciate those things. 

One of the things that I’d like to ask is as a financial leader, as a banker, and we’re talking to entrepreneurs and emerging leaders, how does that banking relationship work? When you’re starting a business, you don’t have five years track record. Your credit may be a little up and down. What is that process to start a strong banking relationship so that you can access capital? You can access a device, right? From a more tradition financial institution, you know, different than venture and private equity. 

Jim: It’s super important to have a relationship with a bank where the banker knows who you are, not just your account number. And let me just tell you a quick story with the paycheck protection program, that really propelled the bank over the last 20 months or so, because when they called the larger institutions, people were just numbers, but when they caught us and we were able to help them, they develop the relationships. 

I think the first thing is develop a relationship with the bank. So you want to be able to call that bank from time to say, hey, I’m having this problem, or this is an opportunity, how do I access credit? Or how do I take advantage of the products and services that your bank actually offers? But it’s, you got to have a relationship, where they know it’s Donald Thompson. 

And then I think the key goes back to what I was saying earlier, check in with that banker from time to time, even if it’s once every six months, because what people do is when they have an opportunity and they need credit, they run into the bank, but they don’t have a relationship with the banker or that bank. And so the bank goes, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. You know, I don’t know you and I know your business, you’re a startup. You don’t have a track record with us. And so that’s what you want to do. You want to build a track record over time. And so when you finally need some credit they’ll know who you are.

They can look at your deposit activity. If you have a credit card with them, they can look at the, your credit card activity. If you have a debit card with them, they can look at your debit card activity. They can tell you what, which financial products make sense for, where you are in your business cycle.

Because there are different, lines of credit are different than term loans. Equipment loans are different than real estate loans. And so, you really want to work with someone who can help grow your business over time while you’re, you know, getting to that next level of whatever it is that you’re trying, you’re trying to achieve.

Don: That’s one of the things that super important, is you don’t go into business because you’re a financial Wiz, typically. You go into business because you have a technology product, you think you’re going to change the world with your new algorithm for a search engine or whatever the case may be.

And so what I’ve found is whether it’s banking, accounting, legal, having people that are experts in their field to help you through those potential minefields is super important. And to your point, before. You have a crisis or a need, right? Cause there’s both needs. And then sometimes there’s, there’s little mini crisis in business. So that’s great, great advice. 

When you think about, kind of the landscape for entrepreneurs and in particular, entrepreneurs of color, how have you seen the landscape change in business for them? And what advice would you give? Because I’ll make the statement and I’ll turn it back over to you. 

A lot of times we believe everything we hear that it’s so difficult for Black founders to get credit and access to capital. And these things are true, I’ve experienced it, I get it, but it’s not impossible. Right, so how do we acknowledge the higher bar, while we create that optimism that, that push to keep going and pushing because there are instruments out there. There are people in networks. What would you recommend in terms of helping that mental model? 

Jim: You know, there, there’s plenty of capital out there. It’s super important that you understand where those capital sources are. And what’s interesting, what’s happening in the banking industry and the financial services industry, believe it or not, 50% of all banking products are not provided by financial institutions. They’re provided by FinTech types of companies. So the Cabbages of the world, the Lending Clubs, they’re providing a lot of the financial services, even though they’re not financial institutions or banks or member FDIC.

So it’s important to figure out who do I really want to partner with? Do I want to partner with a bank or do I want to partner with a lending club? And so of course, I’m going to push the banks, having a relationship, but there are, there are, there are a number of banks, especially the larger ones that have all kinds of different programs for entrepreneurs and small and medium sized businesses and veterans and women owned businesses.

. Those programs are buried into, onto the various big bank’s websites. And so you really want to go into a bank and ask the question. Do you have any specific programs for a startup tech company? Is there anyone I could talk to about how do I apply? Or do you have any programs? Because a lot of banks are offering different kinds of programs over 10 weeks on how to build your business. And so, for example, not to plug our bank.

We just established a partnership with Harvard business publishing. And so we’re going to have business content on our website about, you know, how to develop a business plan, how to have a relationship with a banker, why it’s important to have your ducks in a row related to your financials and how you present yourself with your financials.

And so that information is free. You’ll be able to, it’s from Harvard, but there there’s plenty of, there’s all kinds of information. There’s all kinds of sources, but again, it comes back to, do you have a relationship with the financial person plus to your point, that kitchen cabinet of do you have a lawyer? Do you have an independent person, like a bookkeeper, who does your books? Do you have a marketing consultant? Do you have, you know, whatever, do you have that circle of influence that can help you make the right decisions and kind of avoid the pitfalls when you’re trying to go this direction or that. 

Don: That is powerful advice and one of the things that I would add. A lot of times entrepreneurs think about everything as what they can afford or not afford. Legal, accounting, finance folks are looking for the next opportunity that’s going to be big. So they’ll give you time and help evaluate that because small businesses grow large.

And so everyone, isn’t going to be talking with you with their handout. And quite frankly, when you’re brand new, if they are, sometimes that’s a red flag. You should be looking for folks that believe with you in your idea. And certainly people don’t work for free, but there are creative ways that professionals can work with entrepreneurs until that business starts to sustain itself.

And so I try to encourage folks not to keep the blinders on, that they can only access sound advice when they get to X level or Y level. It’s really the power of your dream, the power of your, the markets you’re going after. And I use it, quite frankly, when I’m looking for creative services, when I’m just starting a new idea, it’s a way to test the idea. Because if I can’t get my, my legal team to be a little bit flexible with this new idea, maybe they don’t believe it will be around in a year. But if they believe with me that it’s going to be around for a year, I’ve seen a little bit more flexibility on all of those different things. And I share that with entrepreneurs. 

Now, zooming out a little bit and kind of just looking at the macro economy and the environment, switch gears, and then we’ll come back to the entrepreneurship. There’s a lot going on in our economy and I hear things, and feel gas prices are going up, inflation is out of control, but when you’re a lay person, not in the financial space, you don’t really know what that means. You feel that impact. So talk to us a little bit about what, what are, what is inflation and, and how is that impacting us in our daily lives? And give us a little education there, if you could. 

Jim: Sure. You know, the federal reserve has, Over the last 20 plus years or so has had a good control over our economy and inflation specifically in terms of the way from a monetary policy standpoint. But given what’s happened over the last 15 to 18 months with the chip shortage, supply chain issues the rising prices of gas, the rising prices of housing, the rising prices of everything else inflation is, um I don’t want to say it’s out of control, but it’s, it’s broadening. Got it. And I think it’s going to take probably another 12 to 18 months before it gets back under control.

And so the average person is going to be spending about $300 more per month just to accommodate these increases, you know, food prices, car prices, gas prices. The federal reserve is planning to raise rates probably tomorrow, a quarter of a point. But they’re in a delicate situation in terms of do they go a quarter of a point or a half a point because they don’t want to drive the economy into recession because we’re still not out of this pandemic, so to speak. And I don’t know if you saw the news this morning, how, there’s been a spike over in China and over in Europe of a different variant of Omicron. So no one really knows. It’s, it’s critical that you spent, you save as much as you can for a rainy day, cause you just don’t know.

You know, inflation has a lot of different factors. And so for example, cars used cars and new cars are factored into that, and gas is factored into that. So everything is not rising. It may seem like that when you, when you’re listening to the news, but it’s various categories that are rising that create the overall economy. You know, airline tickets and, and so there’s different segments that factor into the consumer price index, but prices are actually increasing, some small businesses are passing those prices onto the consumer and labor costs are outrageous at the moment. 

Don: You know, it’s because when you hear things or at least I do, I speak for myself. You feel the impact, but you don’t know what’s creating that impact. And as an entrepreneur, right, and here’s another question. I don’t know the specific answer. I’m like, where’d all the people go. Yes, we had a pandemic, but now to your point, labor costs are rising for every kind of business. Everybody, everybody, right. And it is affecting how you think about growing your, your firm.

What are you doing? What are you thinking about that talent supply? Right? Because you’re an employer, just like I’m an employer in terms of running a business. How’s that affecting you? How are you thinking about it? How are you being creative with it? Because it, what things you’re thinking about doing will affect the tech startup, diversity, equity, inclusion journey, finance, all of us.

Jim: You know, in 2021, we were impacted by the great resignation. And so we had a 25% turnover rate, which is kind of unbelievable on a small company. we were able to hire some really good new people, but I think the key is how do you engage those new employees? I think that’s the key, especially in this zoom environment and hybrid work environment. There’s a, a lot of competition amongst banks.

You know, we’re in the five largest markets of North Carolina, so we’re competing against the largest banks. And some of those banks have actually increased their, their living wage to 19, 20, $21 an hour. We’ve had to do the same thing to retain and attract employees to our, to our bank.

 I don’t see that going away. Once inflation gets out of gets under control, then I think wages will level out, but to answer your question, what you asked first, I think the problem is a couple things. One more people are retiring, number one, number two, females or women are exiting the workforce rapidly because they don’t have the childcare. They’re not getting this support of infrastructure of you know, working, taking care of their child, you know, their kids home cause their school’s closed and all that. 

So I think once we see more women going back into the workforce, then I think you’ll see more opportunity to hire more people, but I think that is the one demographic that’s keeping us where we are today. 

Don: Got it, got it. It’s both interesting and really challenging, because for us, it’s, you know, one of the things we’ve had to think about is how do you up-skill people that may not have all the requirements that you need, but they’re smart, they’re willing to learn, and there’s a longer learning curve to kind of get them where they need to be. So we’ve actually, I don’t want to call it lower the bar, because that’s derogatory, but we’ve had to change the bar such that we have a different view on what an A player looks like. And then we’ve had to increase the way that we train and onboard in order to keep our talent pipeline full, is one of the things we’ve had to think about.

Jim: I think that’s a great strategy. A lot of tech companies are eliminating the need to have a college degree. And then if you have certain skills, they are putting you in, you know, various kinds of certificate programs and training programs. And I think that’s the future. I’m not trying to downplay a college degree, I think a college degree is still important, but I think when you look at it from an employer standpoint, they need a talent. They need the hands; they need to work and they need it now. So they got to think differently, and I think a lot of employers are thinking differently in terms of recruiting and retaining and retention and how do I get diverse talent into my company? I think, I think that’s a positive of all the things that are going on. I actually think that’s a positive. 

Don: Yeah, I would, I would share that. And I’m really fortunate in the work that I’m doing now with The Diversity Movement. So talk to a lot of leaders that are struggling with everything from what is DEI even mean? To I know what it means, I’m into it. How do I implement it? too, man, I’d like to do more, but I got this business crisis over here. And how does it really, really link. 

One of the common threads in the CEOs that I, that I talked to is obviously that talent acquisition, but even more important than that, I’m seeing a lot of CEOs implement, invest in mentoring and career development training. One of the things that we’ve seen in our work that’s a pretty powerful data point through hundreds of companies that we’ve worked with is that the mentorship, that relationship with that direct manager is the linkage to retention. 

And so everyone’s throwing money at people, everyone’s trying to equalize the perks. So those things are there, they’re not going to change the game because everybody’s rising to that pressure. Just like you described in the living rage in the banking space, but that ability for people to see their career being developed on a plan, a program, and people investing in them is one of the things that our market leaders are seeing in terms of helping with those attrition numbers.

And it’s like, you got to, you got to slow down to grow, right? It’s not just task, task, task, its task, train, task, train, right, lead educate. Question for you, as you look at this new economy and how leadership is changing, I’ll make this one statement and then I’ll ask a question. 

10 years ago, five years ago, four years ago, I was still that hard driving entrepreneur, CEO, and a business coach that I was working with said to me very clearly he said, see Don, what kind of success could you have if you were a more empathetic leader? And that statement because I I’m, I’m about achievement. I want to grow. I want to make things happen.

And it stopped me about five years ago in my tracks, and I thought about that and I started a real kind of self-evaluation and how to be a better leader. My question to you having been a leader for many, many years now, a CEO, a former CIO, what are some of the things that you value and want to emulate as a leader, and that you’re still growing in and trying to achieve?

Jim: You know, because of the pandemic, I think it’s critically that as a leader, you’re empathetic because your employees are going through a lot of different challenges all at the same time. So they got the pandemic, childcare issues, inflation, you know, just the whole economy and what’s going on politically and all the racial issues that we’ve had over the last 22 months or so since the murder of George Floyd.

So when I think when you take a step back and just say, what are my employees going through and what are my customers going through and how do I adjust? Because I know they’re going through something. So I think it’s, it’s critical that you show empathy and you become a better, better listener. And also to piggyback on what you said, Donald.

I think it’s important to be a mentor and give back and share kind of what you’re experiencing also to let them know that, you know, you’re human and just cause you know, I sit in this seat doesn’t mean I’m not going through something, but I think you want to recognize that they’re probably going through even more.

Don: That’s right. I, you know, leadership is such an evolving topic for me, and I’m so blessed that I get a chance to talk to a lot of different leaders and, and learn and just see what they’re working through. But I do see strain on those leaders that are used to a more hierarchal style, a more command and control style.

And now the world is an employee centered workplace, and some of these leaders are really struggling with that, that change. And one of the things that I’ve tried to encourage people to do, it seems simple, but you know, it takes time to emulate is really, instead of making statements of what you want to see your team do, tell them the goal that you want achieved and then ask them how they think we should do it.

And as I explained that to some leaders, they’re having an aha moment. It sounds again, super simple, but when we’re all stressed for time, and we’re all doing this as leaders, we tend to make more statements than ask questions and, and I’m encouraging people to do that. My question to you is what are some of the leadership tips?

And now we’re going to circle back a little bit to entrepreneurs because most entrepreneurs typically haven’t led teams of 10, 20, 30, 50 people before, right. It’s their first or second opportunity in leadership. What are some of the things that you would tell an emerging leader to think about, to work on, to make sure that their skills are sharp as a leader?

Jim: You know, that the thing that hits me, the first thing that hits me would be as a leader and as a younger person, as an entrepreneur, interpersonal skills or soft skills are critical. And so I think listening, communication negotiation, public speaking, all of that stuff is super important if you’re going to lead people. You cannot hide behind that phone or that keyboard, and you have to be approachable and you have to be open to either criticism or commentary or hey, maybe there is a different way to do whatever it is that we’re trying to accomplish here at this company. 

And so don’t take yourself too seriously, right, and you’ll be successful. But having that, if you have the opportunity to have that one-on-one time with that particular individual or employee, and then figuring it out what is it that they’re trying to achieve? And if you can kind of blend in whatever the company’s trying to achieve with that, what that individual employee is trying to achieve? Oh man, you can be super successful as a manager leader and your company will be super successful because now everybody is kind of rowing the boat the same way. You’re saying, hey, this guy wants to get here one day. Well, let me channel him and his energy to get there, but also help the company at the same time. 

Don: That is powerful. I mean, basically what you’re describing right is link to personal goals with the corporate goals. But it takes the leader slowing down to really understand what that team member wants.

Jim: Quick thing Recently this year, I actually had my direct reports. I asked them this question, what do you want your legacy to be? And what do you want the bank’s legacy to be? And I actually made them write it down and send it to me. And then I compiled it for everyone that actually reports to me and I shared it with them.

And so now I’m aligning their legacy goals with what we need to achieve, to take the bank to the next level. And, for them to write it down and then see, well, this person’s trying to do this. And this person is trying to do that. And this is how it fits in with, you know, where the bank is trying to go. And it’s working, 

Don: You know this is a, you know, public forum and any advice we share is, is there for the taking. I’m taking that one. Okay, and the reason that I’m smiling is simply because people know the things that they want and desire, and they respect those that want to help them get there.

And what we’re all chasing is to be a part of a team where we feel respected, where we feel valued. And a lot of times entrepreneurs will ask and leaders, CEOs, well, what’s all this belonging stuff at work, right? Like, how do I make someone belong if they don’t want to belong? Right, because they, their, their experiential connectivity to that statement, like they don’t, they don’t get it.

But what you just described very succinctly is based on some questions you can ask employees and then work with them to achieve the things that they want, and that’s one good way of helping people feel belonging at work when their leader in, in your case, is lockstep with them to achieve some of their goals.

And I really appreciate that. I’m going to, I have that mental note down. And so I’ll, I’ll try to give you credit, like next time I’m speaking or whatever, but it’s, it’s a, it’s a good way to implement that in an authentic way. Right? There’s like a leadership book, learning ways, checklist A, B and C, but what you described as asking a very thoughtful and authentic question and then you demonstrated how much you care by doing it. 

Jim: And just so you know, we’ve had a pretty consistent management team. Like I’ve been there seven years, the CFO’s been there nine years. The chief credit officer has been there five years. The chief sales officer been there five years, the vice senior VP over operations has been there seven years.

And so we have a pretty senior team, but we’re trying to take the bank to the next level, and I need all of them to focus on taking the bank to the next level, but how it fits in with them taking it to the next level. 

Don: And, and what is that, you know, when I look at M and F Bank and proud of what you’ve accomplished in a big fan, and we worked together on some of the marketing side, I’m just so pleased that you’ve given us that opportunity and, and we, we continue to earn that trust from you. What’s next level for M and F Bank?

Jim: You know, we we’ve had an unbelievable 2021. We received 18 million in additional capital from the four largest banks in 2021. At the beginning of this year, we’re to, we received an additional allocation from the US treasury of $76 million in additional capital. So the bank will have almost most $120 million and capital, which will allow the bank to grow to about a billion dollars in total assets.

Don: Note to self, I need to come see you.

Jim: So think of it this way. We’re about 375 million, but now we have the fuel or the gas to drive it to a billion-dollar financial institution. So that’s why that legacy conversation is so important because I need them to see how they fit into driving it to a billion dollars. 

Don: That’s awesome. And you know, I’m so excited. We’re sitting in the Earfluence studio, were at American Underground right here in Durham, North Carolina, and there’s so much success that we can talk about and brag about an M and F bank is one of those flagship organizations. And the question that I would describe or ask is you talked a little bit about team. What are some of the things that as a leader you’ve got to do, you want to do to go next level, to get those billion dollars? What are some of the things you’re striving for? 

Jim: We don’t have enough time, but a few things that I, and I shouldn’t share this, but, but it’s important that, I’m active in the banking community I’m the chairman of the North Carolina Bankers Association. I’m involved with the FDIC on a national level. I’m involved with the Independent Community Bankers of America. I’m a chairman of one of their committees on a national committee. We’re not going to get to a billion dollars without some networking with some other banks, networking with investment bankers, talking to people like yourself. 

So I got to let our, my team do what they’re doing to kind of run the bank on a day-to-day basis, but I need to be out there doing more because it’s all about relationships and finding out, oh, here’s a bank that may want to sell itself.

And so you kind of need to be connected to kind of all that’s going on in the financial services, or they think of, oh, M and F has X amount of capital. They can actually do the transaction. So you got to make sure people know that and they understand where your goals are. So when something does happen or something comes across somebody’s desk, you’re top of mind.

Don: There’s no perfect answer, but that was one because that links back to what an entrepreneur has to do, once they get above a million dollars, there’s a, there’s a hustle and a survival mode to get that first revenue threshold. But when you do that in order to get from one to five, five to 10, the leader has to be outside the business.

The leader has to be leading the charge and creating that mantle of success that other people can envision doing business with that organization. And you’ve got to build that team, right, and you’re fortunate to have one and others are developing one that can run the day to day so that leader can continue to grow and think bigger.

And that’s one of the, the challenges that I’m working on right now with The Diversity Movement. We grew from zero to $2.5 million over a hundred clients really quickly over the last two years. And we took this new leap of faith, this new thing we were doing. So we’re building out our technology products, we’ve got our new offering, which is basically our Netflix for DEI.

So companies can subscribe to our platform and they get access to over 500 micro videos. So their company can now have all of their employees access these two-to-three-minute micro videos on DEI topics. It allows us to have an offering that scales through the business, w when people don’t really have the time for 2, 4, 6-hour trainings.

The reason I bring that up is that it’s my job to now think about those next level type of things that we offer and have the same thing that I’m charging my team, which is being able to run and operate that that day to day. And so it’s really exciting to kind of hear we’re in totally different industries, but some of the leadership growth opportunities and challenges are the same. So I really appreciate that. 

When you think about leaders that you admire, who are some of the leaders that you admire and why?

Jim: You know, there’s a number of banking CEOs that I admire. I just think because that’s the industry I’m in. I read a lot of banking journals and banking magazines, just to kind of see what’s going on in the industry and kind of how some of the bigger bankers think without giving their names. I can’t think of just, you know, one specific leader cause I follow a lot of different leaders, but I’m always looking for leaders that are approachable, who are empathetic. 

I think the word visionary is overused but I, but I do think you always want to be looking at what’s going to be next and how and how that’s impacting your business and your industry versus just being so single focused on your actual business. Because a lot of times, if you’re not open to new ideas or what’s happening in the cryptocurrency or the new digital currency, that’s coming out with the, with the federal reserve, you’d better, or you’re left behind, you get left behind. And so that, that would be, you know, the, the main thing is just following people that kind of, you can identify with and just say, hey, I like what he’s thinking. I like what he’s doing, you know, dah, dah, dah, but 

Don: Final question for me. So I make a statement and then I’m going to give you the final word, but I’m going to give you time to think about it. It’s going to ask you if you had a magic wand, what would you do in this world? What would you, what would you want to see different if you had a magic wand?

And so that’s going to be my question. So I’m going to say a couple of wrap-up comments for entrepreneurs, and they’re going to come back to you with that, with that question. One of the things that I wanted to share with our audience, as I talk with Jim and listen to some of his leadership lessons is just to say leadership is a journey you’re going to make mistakes.

It’s okay as long as we don’t make the same mistakes again and again, and we learn from them. And we don’t try to hide behind our title as if we didn’t make a mistake. And one of the things I had to learn as a CEO is that if it happens good, right? And I get the credit, if it happens bad, then I got to be equally as vigilant to take blame.

And it’s, it’s both of those things, right? And, and sometimes people will see my name up in lights and, and I know that the team behind me helped propel me forward to achieve that goal or that recognition. and then when something doesn’t go quite right, I have to really look at how I led the team and what was my contribution to, to getting it there.

So that level of leadership, humility, I would say is the biggest thing that has grown in me over, probably seven to 10 years, that maturity of how to look at things, but I’ll, I’ll, I’m interested. There’s so much going on in the world. There’s so many things that, that one could describe, but if you had the magic wand, right, what would you, what would you want to do to help this world be a better place with that magic wand?

Jim: It’s very simple. I would love to reduce the wealth gap. Let me, if I have time to give you a statistic, the American Banker published this last summer, and I’m going to send this article to you. Please take it. It’d be important for you and your business. 

Donald, did you know that I’m just a consumer to consumer, a white consumer and a Black consumer, the wealth gap is a 10 to one, in terms of your net worth. But if you’re a business owner, it’s three to one.

And so if we have more entrepreneurs, more business owners, the wealth gap reduces to three to one. And so if you have a relationship with a financial institution and you’re a business owner, you can potentially reduce that wealth gap down significantly and create a better life for your community, for yourself and for your family.

Don: Jim, that will be the last word that cause that that is concise. That’s what we’re trying to do. You and I are similar in that we want to see our impact and what we do each day affect the community in a positive way, and I’m a big fan. And as I watch M and F and I’ve read about the articles and different things and that some of the work that we are able to do with you, I’m just so glad that you’re in our community and you’re leading the way and you’re given that inspiration to many others and I sincerely appreciate it. Thank you so much for spending time on us, on the Donald Thompson Podcast. it was great. 

Jim: Yeah, Donald, thank you. And I appreciate everything you’re doing for our community. You’re a tremendous leader and you’re doing some great work. We appreciate all your support.