I don’t know. I’d probably say that I was ambitious and creative and loyal and I love whatever industry I’m applying for.

Courtney: So that’s pretty generic. 

Dana: I know. I suppose they are. That’s why they’re boring. 

Courtney: I don’t know what I would say. I’m an out of the box thinker.

Dana: And that’s it. 

Courtney: And that’s it. The end, I mean, out of the box thinker, out of the box thinker, I love to be creative and, help other people be their best creative selves. 

Dana: It is extremely boring.

Courtney: I don’t know about ambitious say, semi-procrastinating. 

Dana: Yeah. I thought it was great. I loved her.

Courtney: I loved how she said that she put the person on there that would lie for her. Who is the person that you would sign up, put down to lie for you?

Dana: I’d probably be you, yeah. I have lied for people before, and jobs.

Courtney: Yeah oh, so it should be you. Would you lie for me? 

Dana: I am. I’m actually a really good liar. 

Courtney: That’s actually true. I probably would put you, yeah,

Dana: I don’t know. Maybe you would not be a good person. You’re not a very good liar. 

Courtney: I’d lie for you. 

Dana: Yeah, you would, but you wouldn’t be good at it. I could see right into it. Yeah, I don’t know if that’s a good thing to be proud of, is that I’m a good liar. 

Courtney: I mean, I can be a good liar, like on the phone you could call me, but you’re like a good to your face liar, like have a meeting and I’m still bs-ing you in front of you, it’s true. And for me, they’re like, all right, you’re telling the truth?

Dana: I feel like it’s an episode of Friends when Phoebe’s trying to teach Joey had a lie and like, and he does great until he, and she’s like, and there’s always a point where there’s a point of no return. And you say some comment that isn’t necessary to the point of the story, then you’re like, huh, you created that seed of doubt that it’s not the truth and that is your problem. I call it verbal diarrhea. Like you just start, I’m like just, you could have stopped talking like 10 minutes ago and I would believe what you said, but now nobody believes what you’re saying. I know. I know. 

Courtney: I love how she talked about that first business, right. She did a little job and then she was like, I’m going to go out on my own. I need to make more money. And she had this first business and he says that I’m good at graphic design.

And so she went out on this, her own graphic design company and taught herself graphics design, but she said, yes, I’m good at it, right. And she decided that it was something that was so close to her. Like her creativity, her designs were so close to her that she felt like she couldn’t take criticism.

And that, that’s true. Like, I’ve definitely felt like there is times in my life where there was something that was like, so close to me that I like couldn’t take criticism about it. Definitely in business. Oh yeah, I mean, I felt like totally the Bradford at the very beginning was that way for us.

Dana: Well, I still feel like you feel that way. Like you have a really hard time taking criticism about the Bradford. It’s true, so we had this group of no, no, no. We had this group of, of college students come and tour the Bradford, right? Yeah, and they are in this event management class.

And so they went, and we ended up having a follow-up meeting with the professor because we were trying to, just for multiple reasons. And he was saying how the, the class came back and he said, okay, what would you change? And he’s telling us in this meeting, like the things that these people would change, and I could just see Courtney and she was like, trying to justify why we made these decisions.

And how it is, and the truth is they don’t have any of the background, but like, I did not feel like I had to justify one to like a 22-year-old who knew nothing about it. Like, I didn’t have like the same, like, need to be like, well, this is why we made this decision. Like there’s reasons for it. But I could tell that you were like getting, not, you weren’t even upset. You weren’t upset about it. It was an angry. No, but you were like, you felt like you had to prove why you made that choice.

Courtney: I personally felt like in that, and I knew you were going to say this, I personally felt like they were not taking to consideration impervious surface rules surrounding the county. 

Dana: But it doesn’t matter. But you know, they don’t know that. But so to me, like they could say that and I’m like, yeah, you’re absolutely correct. That is a total valid point that I would love it if the parking lot wasn’t how it was. But this is, you know, part of the reason why it is. I don’t need to, I didn’t, I didn’t feel defensive about it.

I didn’t feel like I was like, I had to justify it because they don’t know. And that, and that was the whole point, because you’re saying this I’m trying to like, because the whole point of it is it’s a learning experience for these people. 

Courtney: Right. I guess I can accept your criticism if I agree with it as what it is. Like, if someone came to me and said the Bradford has some shitty kitchen cabinets, I’d be like, you know what the Bradford does have some shitty kitchen cabinets. Yeah, I agree with that. You can criticize it all you want, or like maybe there’s one too many scuff marks on a, on a baseboard. I would be like, amen. Preach it. Like, I feel the same. But if I feel like it’s unwarranted or like you don’t have all the information and you’re criticizing, then I think I have a hard time with that. 

Dana: I will agree with that.

Courtney: Yeah. I personally think for me, it stems back to like our family. Like it comes back, like when I think about criticism and like unwarranted criticism, or I think you should X, Y, Z, it brings me right back to like aunts, cousins, uncles. All the things that people telling you, this is what you should do, but you have no idea.

Dana: But I don’t know why that bothers you so much. I mean, it literally just say the same thing to me and I just smile and grin, like, yeah, that’s a great idea. And then I don’t give it any two shits thoughts after it, because it doesn’t matter. I know that they don’t know anything about it. I know they have no understanding of why we are making the decisions we’re making and I didn’t come to them and ask them questions. So I don’t value their opinion. 

Courtney: They’re just speaking out of their ass is what I feel like it is. Do you know what I’m saying? I think that it’s more along those lines.

Dana: I think, but I think that the crucial difference between me in you it’s like that gets under your skin. Where, for me, that is the one thing I could totally just like brush off because I’m like, cause I don’t respect them. I don’t value their opinion. So I don’t, I just don’t care. 

Where I have a hard time taking criticism is kind of where you’re saying, it’s where I. I feel like I’ve been wronged and most of the time it’s about like, it’s more about me. It’s not about a product, not about like my building. It’s not about my design or whatever. It’s more about something having to do with me, like an action that I took.

And then it being misconstrued in a certain way. Yeah, like when someone comes to me and says, they want to give me criticism or feedback on the way I handle the situation and it’s because they feel like I acted in a way that was malicious or whatever, when that really wasn’t my intent. That is when I have a really hard time with it, because it’s like those things like, well, you know me, like, why would you ever think that I would do that? You’ve done that to me before, like in fights, you’re like, you think, blah, blah. I’m like, I don’t I’ve, those words have never came out of my mouth. I actually do not think that. You know? 

 I think that the Bradford and our business is such a huge part of your identity of who you are as a person that when someone criticizes it, it literally feels like they’re criticizing you. Like you can’t separate the two as to like, it’s my business and who you are. Like, they’re so intertwined. 

Courtney: I think yes and no. Yes, I know you think yes, because you just said it, but I, I mean, I could see that at some point, but there is a lot about my life that’s not related to the business at this point.

Dana: Well, okay. So maybe in the past year, this is slowly going, separating itself, but for the past, like five, six years is what it was. 

Courtney: Definitely. I mean, I definitely think that 

Dana: whenever we’re talking about these times, when you get the angriest about criticism, it’s like it’s in those years of, 

Courtney: but I would like to say this conversation with this Meredith people that that was like two months ago, I wasn’t like upset about it. I was just trying; you want to poke holes. I’m like, this is why you have these.

Dana: But that’s the whole, like, that, that was like the whole point of the exercise for these students is for them to, to say to the owner, this is what I think should happen. And for you to graciously say, like, I think that is actually a really great design idea and I love that design idea. And I would execute that design idea, except for…

Courtney: I’d like to, this was not presented by students. It was literally just him off the cuff saying, 

Dana: which again is another reason why I should have just like blown over and been like, oh, 

Courtney: impervious surface, nope bad idea.

Dana: Right. But I mean, that’s the whole point was that they were to pitch it and then for them to stick it a roadblock and say, we have this issue so how would you solve this now? And maybe they can come up with a different idea that would work great. I don’t know. 

Courtney: Yeah. I think that just like ending this conversation on criticism is like my conscious self and my subconscious self are at war with each other over that. When someone criticizes, I don’t consciously care. I’m not looking for validation from like a 22-year-old student. I’m not looking for validation from like an unsuccessful family member, that’s telling me how I should run my business. I don’t need validation from either of them, but why does it annoyed me so much? 

Dana: I don’t know. 

Courtney: That’s, what’s so bizarre to me. 

Dana: I think it goes back to what she said, like what she realized when she learned how to actually take criticism was that what she’s saying was small to her, but it was big to somebody else. And I think that there are things that are big to us as people that we don’t know about it, maybe until it faces, like we have to like hear criticism or 

Courtney: I think for me, like when I think about like just particular people that I’m getting criticism from, I consider the source. And if I feel like they’re criticizing something that I’m doing to level the playing field for them, or to make them feel better like, or, or that they’re like imparting something. Do you know what I’m saying? That’s what annoys me, like you’re trying to speak into my business or my success or my life because of how it makes you feel more valid about what’s not going right in your life. Do you know what I mean? 

Dana: But do you think that’s a reflection of them or a reflection of you? Like how you’re feeling about it? Do you think that’s an actual? 

Courtney: how I’m feeling about it? It’s probably a reflection of me, but I think what they’re doing is a reflection of them. So, I mean, maybe both, 

Dana: I don’t know, I guess is that I think with certain characters yes. I think there is some truth in that. No, and because there’s history, evidence and proof, right? I think for majority people that are coming at you as a friend, as a student or whatever, they’re, that is not what it is. That is literally just a, I just want to learn more, be more, be helpful to the thing. 

Courtney: But like if another venue owner came to me and said, hey, I think you should X, Y, Z, and it was like, constructive. Like I think this would be a better whatever. Like I would totally take that, yeah.

Dana: But it’s why I don’t ever give really, I don’t ever impart advice on anybody, especially another venue owner, unless they specifically ask me a question and I will answer that specific question, but I will not freely give up information because I understand how hard it is to take that for someone to, especially where we are considered a successful venue, as a new venue and telling a new venue like, oh, you should do X, Y, Z, and they’re not doing that like how hard that would be to hear. 

Courtney: Yeah, and she may not be able to. 

Dana: Right. And it’s not fair, you know? So I, do play that. I’m actually very quiet and I do not give criticism unless someone specifically asked me for it, pertains to business. 

Courtney: Unless you’re like my employee or like maybe my child or whatever I’m not like an overly critical person to other businesses, not one to go and speak into somebody else’s business. I keep my opinion to myself. 

Dana: Right, unless they ask. And, but I, I love, I love dissecting it. I think that’s where, like, part of our joy of like, doing like venue consulting comes in is because we love looking at it and like, here’s our problem.

This is what we want to solve. Here’s how we can do that, and like getting really creative thinking outside the box because it’s not, we’re not in our box on our venue. Were in something else, and it’s really, it’s really fun and it’s really exciting to try and to I don’t know, look on the outside of it.

And every single time I feel like too, it makes our business stronger because you realize something about the market or you realize the strategy like, oh, this is a great idea. Like we should utilize this as well. I know I do. Also, why we don’t like consult in our market. Outside of our market. 

But I mean to the last thing was talking about criticism and I really loved this, was in the beginning when she was saying how she didn’t even realize, because when she started her business, it was all her friends and family that were, that she was doing this for, and they really weren’t paying clients. So therefore they had no right to say anything, and it wasn’t until that first paying client that she realized, oh, I’m not good at this. This is when she said it’s too close to me. 

And I, it made me really think about when we first started and how much we devalued ourselves. Like we did things for free. We did things for nominal cost, and how hard it was for people to respect us because they weren’t paying us. 

Courtney: That’s right. I think people value what they, it to be different, but it’s not, I think people place value on money. So what they’ve spent money on, they value, right? Like they don’t see you as an expert even though you may be right, the top of your field, if they’re not paying you something, right. They don’t value you as that expert. 

Dana: Well, especially in the beginning when you’re saying like, cause we did two weddings for free in the beginning and it was like, oh, we’re just trying to build our portfolio. So therefore they didn’t think that we knew we were doing at all. And there was a lot of, we didn’t know we were doing, but we were just, and it sounds so braggartly, but like inherently, we were good at it. Like we were just good at it. And there was a lot of about who we were, how we operate, like how we think that made us good at what we did where we perfect a hundred percent?

Like, no, not at all, but it was definitely something we were like, we’re, we’re in the right lane, you know, and we were not respected for that because we were like, we’re just going to try this out, you know? 

Courtney: Even just like the work ethic, like how much effort and work it goes into like putting together some of these events I felt like was just negated because they didn’t pay for it. Like, it was just kind of like taken for granted, you know what I mean? We learned that lesson even later on in our business where we gave somebody the venue for free, and we decided we were never going to do that again. Like we even, that just kind of felt like, and it wasn’t necessarily the person, but it was how.

Dana: The mentality? 

Courtney: The mentality, but how it made us feel, right? Like it didn’t make us feel valued and appreciated. You know, it made us feel a little bit like put out in some ways. And it was very clear that maybe not all the money, but monies had to be exchanged. Do you know what I’m saying? To make every partner feel comfortable?

And so I think that there is something said to paying for a service or a good or whatever it is that makes you put place more value on it and take it seriously. 

Dana: Yeah. I agree. I thought that then when she said that I immediately thought of this first two years and I was like, oh, I don’t know. I would never want to go back there again. No, never again. 

Courtney: Not I do not want to go back either. 

Dana: I think to your point too, it wasn’t even that, like I said, we only did two weddings for free, but it took us years to learn that lesson because it wasn’t that we did it for free, but we didn’t value ourselves enough to charge what we thought we should charge or throw something in for free, like our, one of our very worst reviews, I think we’ve mentioned on the podcast here, was because the client didn’t want to pay for servers. And we just said we would do it because we didn’t, we didn’t want to, we wanted to seem like a team player.

We wanted to seem like we were invested and really all it did was made us do our job poorly because we weren’t present because we were busing new stables, right? 

Courtney: Yep. We were servers and not planners. 

Dana: I know. And I was pregnant and it was hot 

Courtney: It was in a back yard. It was very difficult, but lesson learned. 

Dana: I also really loved when she talked about the difference of being an employee and an employer. And she said, because as an employer, you have to make the damn thing from scratch. And I felt that very deeply. 

Courtney: Yes you do. Yeah, that is true. 

Dana: I know, but I just, I remember there were so many times I would come home and I’d be like, oh, I just want to go work at a bridal salon because I love, I love brides and I love weddings, but I don’t want to, I don’t want to own this anymore. I’m going to go work for somebody. I just went like, turn this off at the end of the day, I’m like, go work for somebody. I don’t want to own this shit. 

Courtney: Yeah. And then like on the other flip side of it is like, there’s been times that we had at the employee that we hired erroneously and fired erroneously and then went off to do their own business. Like obviously you made it look too easy, like thinking oh, like this is a walk in the park, but there’s actually a whole lot that goes into building a business and building a brand and coming alongside as an employee is not the same thing as starting something.

Dana: There’s no security, right? Yeah, like that’s the hard part is there’s no security and it’s even, even now, like when you’re looking at it, you’re like, oh, we’re doing well. And I always tell my husband, I was like, I cannot guarantee you one quarter to the next, I can guarantee you what’s going in the account this quarter. That is it.

I can project, and I can give you some percentage of certainty, but I cannot guarantee anything else right now. So do not bank anything we need on what you think I’m going to make, because this is all that I can guarantee right now. 

That’s true. That’s totally true. You don’t know when shit’s going to hit the fan.

You have no idea. You don’t know someone’s going to break. What have we done this year? We’ve had replaced two AC units. We’ve fixed all the windows. Yep. We installed a new fence. 

Courtney: We have fixed the plumbing 30,000 times. Now we’re getting new toilets that are automatic flush because people cannot flush toilets and apparently in an event venue.

Dana: They’re just too aggressive, but regardless they’re breaking our toilets. 

Courtney: Yeah. So we purchased lots of new toilet handles. 

Dana: But anyways, here, all that to say is like, I don’t know. I feel like we’re just one disaster away from being like, oh, there goes the savings, and there’s no buffer. So therefore you’re back to normal programming of what you used to make before, right. 

Courtney: So, yeah, I definitely think it’s very different, being the employer than being the employee. And I think that you have to have more than just, the creativity, like you have to want to own a business. 

Dana: I do think that, and I, and I, I just, I don’t know. I can totally envision that like when just the, the idea of how you have to make it from scratch no matter what, no matter if you’re entering into a market where someone’s already done, what you’re trying to do, you still have to decide from the very basic level, like who you are, what’s your business.

What’s your brand? And you have to build it and you’re going to get it wrong. And so you’re going to get like halfway there and you’re like, oh, that’s not what, I really want. Let’s like reinvent ourselves, let’s go back to the, wipe it all clean, cause we’ve done that a couple of times where we’ve like, we don’t like this brand that we’re putting out there.

Like, let’s try this again. Like let’s revamp and relaunch and redo, and if I hear the word launch one more time in the next two years. Oh my gosh, we’ve launched this. We’ve launched that we’ve launched this. No more launching, just going to sail. Can we, can we just please plateau?

Courtney: No, it’s impossible. It is impossible. I also like how she was talking about how, just because you like something doesn’t mean you should make it a business. Oh yeah. That’s always been hard for me. Yeah, I agree. Even like outside of work, like thinking, oh, I love this. I can make this a business. I can make this, and there is some maturity in being able to say, I love doing this and it doesn’t have to make me money. 

Dana: Oh yeah, I know, but I actually don’t really have that problem. I think prior to owning the business, I w would have, I had that mentality one, I think is again, a product of our upbringing. Like everything had to, everything had a monetary value and we make it sound like we had this. Like, we like our have crazy people, that we are a family. Every family is slightly crazy, but they’re all very loving. But I feel like, it was always we collected things because it was going to be worth money one day.

Right. Think about like the beanie baby craze or, you would find like, our family is like, like one step away from hoarders. I believe they have a lot of stuff. Like I went, but they love things but it’s not, it’s not that they love things in terms of like materialistically, but there is some emotional connection to this knick-knack and it reminds them of the auction they went to and they got this, like, there’s all these stories. And I do love that it’s very sentimental and I am a very sentimental person, but a lot of it, it was purchased, it was found because it was worth money. Like, oh, I found this, what’s that, that like cast iron, something, Griswold or something, that like thing and it’s worth money and they hold it and I’m like, well, are you going to sell it? And they’re never going to sell it, but there’s something about that, that value of owning it, right. 

And so, and I feel like there was always that like, oh, you have to monetize what you love, right. And I think once we opened C&D and w I, honestly, I had, I don’t even think it was the Bradford was different, I think it was C&D. And I was like, I don’t, I don’t need to do this, this isn’t because it’s not easy.

And I, I recognize that, like, I can look at something and be like, oh, I can make. this and make money on it. And like, I don’t, I know I had to like market it and then I have to actually make all this shit for it. And then I have to like, figure out how to pay taxes on it. And I’m like, I don’t want to do that, I’d rather just give it to you. Like, this is my charity project here. 

Courtney: I know, but I think a lot of people like maybe they’re trying to support their hobby by monetizing it. Sure. Right. But I, I personally think that that is no way to be successful. Like, I think you have got to have a passion for what you’re doing, but you have to also have a passion for like business in general. And if you don’t have a passion for it, like it’s not going to be successful. I think it’s very few people who have a jobby, a job hobby that makes it into something that’s actually like a business or an actual job. But yeah, I totally loved that you can just be good at something and just be good at something and it not do anything, but just bring you joy or enjoyment.

Right? Like I think that I’m a fairly decent quilter, quiltmaker. I mean, I definitely could be better, like if I practice more, but, I enjoy it like three months out of the year. and I don’t enjoy it outside of that. And there was a time where I was like, I could sell these. Hmm. I don’t want to do that.

I don’t want the pressure of that at all. And then I, and then I think about it, I’m like, okay, well, I’ve spent $90 on fabric. I’ve spent $30 on stuffing. And then I’ve put in 80 hours of my time, like, what would I have to sell this quilt for, to make it worth my time? Is something like $2,000? No, one’s buying my $2,000 quilts.

Dana: Yeah. 

Courtney: Do you know what I’m saying? Like, it doesn’t make any sense, right. So I think that sometimes you are devaluing what you’re doing when you’re trying to put some sort of dollar amount and make money on it. Like, it would be very demoralizing to me to take my quilt and be like, here’s a $200 quilt.

Dana: Yes, but if you like really loved it, you’d get like a quilt maker, essentially like a quilter, like a big arm quilter that could quilt it quickly.

Courtney: Yeah, but then I think, I think about the logic of that, like, those things are crazy expensive. Like how many quilts,

Dana: but somebody is making money on quilts because we all have quilts. But here’s the thing. As someone has figured out that they love. They figured out how to monetize it. They figured out how to make it worth their time and they’re being successful at it. And I think that that is, that is the point is 

Courtney: these people aren’t selling quilts though. They are selling patterns and they’re selling fabric. That is where the money is. 

Dana: No, but my point is, is that just because you’re good at something doesn’t mean you have the business sense to sell it is more what I think should be said. Like it is not about like sure, everyone can sell it or whatever, and then you get to the bottom of your life.

This isn’t worth it, but there’s very few people who can take something that they’re good at, that they love and then figure out how to monetize it with a decent profit. Right. And I think that is where the lesson is. Not everyone can do that. Not, and like, even as someone who owns a business in a successful app business, you obviously can’t figure out how to monetize and sell a quilt.

Courtney: I can’t. 

Dana: You know, it’d be very expensive, yes. Well I also really loved her fish analogy. 

Courtney: Oh, I loved that that.

Dana: That was really great. I think it was a great way to visualize problems. And I do think that we get into this situation where we have a problem and we think it’s one thing, and then you get down into it and you’re like, oh, well that was not the problem. Yeah, that’s just what we wanted it to be. And it really actually wasn’t high now. 

Courtney: Yeah, by light. It was the pool of people that you’re. 

Dana: The ocean was the market, right. And the bait was like, how people are finding you. The hook is how you’re reeling them in, essentially. The fish is the, you know, the fish is the client, and then the fishermen was you.

Courtney: Right, you’re the fishermen. 

Dana: Were you in the same podcast? 

Courtney: Yeah, I was. I thought you said fisherman. I know. Is that it before you finished the -erman. 

Dana: Yeah. So I loved that. I think it’s a great way to approach problems in business. Like, is it my market? Is it how I, like trying to sell myself, is that how I’m reeling them in?

You know, and we do that slightly, like with statistics, like with the Bradford we have, this is how many inquiries we get. So this is how much bait we got, right. And then how are we going to do, how many of that do we get to tour? Like, what’s that hook? And then how many of that tour do we actually get to book, you know, your fish, right. And you can kind of see the breakdown and we have percentages; we try to keep up. But yeah. 

Courtney: I thought it was good. I thought that it was a clear way to look at it. And I think a lot of times it’s the fisherman. 

Dana: I think most, I think like 90% of the time it’s the fishermen. I think sometimes it’s the bait. Oh, I think that’s another big one that, I shouldn’t say sometimes, the next biggest issue is the bait. Because I think we undersell ourselves too much. And if you can’t articulate the kind of client you want and, and you can’t be confident into what you’re selling and who you are then, you’re never going to get that client.

Courtney: Yeah, I think that’s definitely true. I feel like I could talk about planning to anybody, even though I not planning weddings, I could talk in a very thorough way that would make anybody want to book me for planning because I’ve had so much experience. So you can like speak to all the situations, you know? And I think it’s easy to sell once you’re super confident in what you’re doing, and you think your bait is more attractive. 

But I love that. Like, I thought that getting back to, Abbie, that when she had the two failed businesses, she went back into the workforce to work on some of those weaknesses, right. To kind of like improve her bait and how she felt about it and what she was putting out there. I thought that was like very insightful. 

Dana: Well, yeah, but it was brought about by her friend telling her, hey, you need to go do this. Like, you need to go learn how to, how to take criticism. You need to go learn how to understand like why you’re failing essentially. And I love, I love that idea, especially for a solo preneur, like having what I call that board of directors. Right. And it’s something that I don’t, I honestly never thought as an issue on probably because I, we always had each other, but I really came across.

Like as something that was really important for businesses during COVID, I felt like we served on a lot of peoples as board of directors for people that would call and say, like, I don’t have a business partner, so I need to bounce this idea off you. Like, I don’t know how many times a caterer, a planner called and said, this is my situation.

What would you do? How would you handle it? And they didn’t always take my advice, but I always gave them an opinion about how I would handle. 

Courtney: Yeah, I love that about our industry. 

Dana: Yeah, I know. Yeah. But I, my question would be like, what, who would serve on your board of directors? Other than me, obviously 

Courtney: definitely my friend Krista, because I feel like, we’re always like on the same wavelength so we can talk without defining terms, if that makes sense, like, oh, this is by actually meant or whatever, you could just say it.

And also she’s not afraid to like point out where I’m being ridiculous or where maybe I’m not working to my fullest self, you know? But I don’t know, like somebody that I would have to be like, somebody that I admire, like somebody that I respect what they’re doing in business. So I don’t even, I can’t even think of somebody necessarily like in our industry that I would put on our board of directors, for me personally. 

Dana: Because you’re like afraid to say it out loud?

Courtney: I don’t know, like there’s women who, like, I find super inspiring, like Sara Blakely with like Spanx and whatnot and, 

Dana: Let’s talk about attainable board of directors, like right now in your life, not like this is not like an ideal board of directors. This is like, if you were by yourself and you had issues, who would be, who would you call right now in your life? You’re not going to call Sara Blakely. 

Courtney: Maybe she’ll answer. I doubt it. I would call Rachel Sheeran probably because I think she would keep me motivated, like, and super pumped up. I would have Krista cause she would keep me super grounded.

I would definitely have you because you would have insight into my like current situation, right. And then I don’t know. I would want somebody that I kind of admire their like all togetherness, like how they keep all their balancing, their work life, shit together. Like, I don’t know who that is.

Dana: Mystery person.

Courtney: Mystery person. Do you have any, any applicants for that one? 

Dana: I don’t know but I think that’s, I think that’s like a farce in general, so 

Courtney: I don’t know. Maybe it’ll come to me. Who’s on your board?

Dana: I feel like mine would be so much bigger, which is part, like part of the issue. Like, so when I’m having an issue, the people that I call, like I, I love my friend, Becky for her personal, like my personal life balance.

Courtney: Like I feel like she has her shit together. 

Dana: I think she I think she does yeah. I think she has a really good balance of life and expectations. Yeah. and I appreciate that. And she’s as someone who can speak truth, but she’s also someone who can speak truth in a way that you can hear it. Which I need that’s just how I need to, I appreciate that. I do, I call my friend Nikki a lot we are not, or kind of in different phases of life, but I feel like she has great like overarching business sense, like business goals. Yeah. Like she’s been part of her family business for many, many years. So I feel like that’s helpful. And she also understands the family business side of things sometimes like that emotional, like ownership, legacy type things. That’s always super helpful. 

I call my grandmother a lot. I call my Nina, like, because I think she just makes me remember, like reminds me of all the good things in life and like that I’m, that I’m that I’m good. Yeah. You know what I mean? Like she’s always a quick to, 

Courtney: she’s a very affirming person, 

Dana: very affirming person, and I do appreciate that. I do love Rachel. She would probably be on there because if you ever need to, like, you need to need to be convinced to something, she can convince you of anything. Okay, like anything. Yeah, but she also, at the same time will tell you when you’re being stupid. Like she did one time tell us like that’s stupid idea. 

And it was a stupid idea. It was a stupid idea, even though we didn’t listen to it, but yeah, point for you, Rachel. but yeah, I think that would probably be it. And I, I mean, I don’t think I’d put Sam on their cause I don’t think he would be objective enough. Like he just goes along with whatever I think, because he wants me to be happy, but I do appreciate his grounded-ness. 

Courtney: Yeah. I think that’s good. Yeah. Notice how I wasn’t on there?

Dana: Hey, you were, did I not say you. No you’re on there too, sorry. 

Courtney: I’m going to be used to be a secretary and take minutes on what everybody else says. 

Dana: I think I just assumed I said it. Yeah, no, I do think that I feel like you know me better than anybody else.

Courtney: Probably accurate. You don’t have any backstory for me? No. Yeah. It’s all just front story. 

Dana: You don’t even need to say it out loud. Apparently 

Courtney: I actually pack snacks for you when we go places, I’m like, oh, I’m just going to need a snack. At some point, I feel like it’s now it’s true 

Dana: out of her. My stomach growling.

Courtney: Yes. Yes, I am.

Dana: I thought it was really good. I think, I think what I loved to sum it up was her energy. I loved her transparency and I loved just how true she was by who she was like, she was like, I, I think there was something really refreshing about her just saying like, it made me mad. I didn’t like it.

I loved how she said I realized I was being super petty because I just, this person was annoying me, like, who says that? Like, and I love that because it’s so true. Like I’ve been petty so petty before with clients because they’ve annoyed me. Like, I don’t know. I just love that. Yeah, the authenticity of that, 

Courtney: I thought she was super authentic, for sure. Like she like had a real true sense of self and I appreciated. And like being able to talk about her weaknesses and talk about her strengths, like celebrate those. Realize where she would needed to grow and where she didn’t need to grow. Right. And like own all of that, you know? Cause I think it’s really refreshing when someone can like own when they’re a bad-ass but then also own when they’re like failing at something. I thought she did that really, really well. Yeah. 

Thanks everyone for gathering us today to talk about the hustle, to learn more about Abbie, her business, and her podcast, visit forherempire.com or follow her on Instagram at forherempire. We hope you get a chance to make a Virgin pineapple mint mojito this week in honor of Abbie and cheers to accepting criticism. 

Dana: And to learn more about our hustles visit canddevents.com. thebradfordnc.com hustleandgather.com and anthemhouse.com.

Or follow us on Instagram at canddevents at thebradfordnc at hustleandgather and at anthem.house. And if you liked this show, be sure to subscribe and leave us a rating and review. 

Courtney: This podcast is a production of ear fluence. I’m Courtney 

Dana: and I’m Dana 

Courtney: and we’ll see you next time on Hustle and Gather