Marcus: Yeah. Well, I, grew up just outside of the Washington DC area in Alexandria, Virginia many folks have heard and seen and know about, Remember the Titans, TC Williams High School was my local high school. I did not attend TC Williams, but just to give everybody an idea of, you know, kind of where that is and, what was going on in Alexandria.

Yeah, I was a very successful high school basketball player was, was very grateful and lucky to be coached by the son of a hall of Famer, Morgan Wooten who most high school basketball fans would know. His son, Joe Wooten was my coach in high school. And., was lucky enough to have a very successful, you know, run at it in, in high school and was highly recruited out of high school and, and got to play at my dream school at the University of North Carolina. So that’s what originally got me down here to the Southern part of, blue heaven is I like to say. 

Yeah, had a phenomenal five years.   here in, in North Carolina. I was lucky to take that victory lap. So I had a great experience with school, had a, a great experience with basketball, obviously playing at a super high level, won a national championship in 2009, had a very interesting road up to that point   to, to get to the national championship, and I’m sure we’ll, we’ll dive into that a little bit. you know, as we get going through this, but, was super amazing to be coached by a legendary coach and coach Williams and just all the lessons that he was able to teach us as players and as young men.

I’m somebody that I still lean on to this day and is still a very, very big influence in my life and in the lives of, of all the people who played at Carolina and even just Carolina fans, you know, so it’s a, it’s pretty special to, to have been a part of a, a great high school organization to have been a part of a great university and, and a great basketball program and, and family that we always talk about the Carolina family. So I’ve been very, very lucky in, you know, my basketball experiences both here, and overseas. 

Dana: I don’t think I ever understood the magnitude of winning the NCAA until I started dating my husband and his obsess. Which by the way, the year that I, he in 20, when I would turned 21, the year that UNC won, that was my 21st birthday and we were dating. So he had a good time, and that’s how I knew he really loved me, is that he went out to dinner with me and didn’t and he was, we had to go somewhere there was a TV, but he still acquiesced. He didn’t have to be home watching the game. I was like, there you go. 

Yeah, but all I say is that it’s such an accomplishment. I don’t think I realized like how, like I, think I always knew that college sports had definitely was like a certain level, but I didn’t realize how very few times people win that championship.

Marcus: Yeah I mean, there’s a lot of schools out there that have never even been close, you know? I know. So, it makes it even more, amazing really, in my opinion, to, to walk into the Smith center and see how many times have we been able to get to that point. It’s a very special feel and there’s a lot of, lot of work that goes into it.

Courtney: Well, I didn’t think much about it, like then cuz in early twenties and we went to an all-girl school and there obviously isn’t a huge, you know, collegiate program. 

We had a great basketball team, but whatever, wasn’t the big thing. But watching it now, like just this past year watching it and like just like feeling all of the emotions about it and we’re not even in the middle of it, but as an adult or as someone who’s worked really hard for something, to grow something, to like get to those like pinnacle moments. I don’t know, kind of has more meaning now. I feel like than it did even then. 

Dana: Yeah. 

Courtney: So like the big build up and then yeah. You gonna make it, you’re not gonna make it. It feels like there’s a lot riding on those.

Marcus: There is, you know, there definitely is. There definitely is and for, you know, some, some young men and, and women out there that are competing at that stage at that level, you’re right there there’s a lot   on the line and I think you learn from a very young age. One of the things I love about sports to your point, you learn about all the work that goes into it and will it pan out   maybe, maybe not.

And if it doesn’t, how do you rebound from that? How do you continue on how, you know, how do you use that as, as fuel to continue? And I mean, there’s just so many great lessons that we learn from sports. 

Courtney: Well, I always feel like for me, it’s like, I don’t necessarily believe in luck, but I will believe in being ready to take those opportunities. Do you know what I mean? So like you’ve worked, it’s not luck that you got there. Although some, there’s always a lucky break here and there for sure. But it’s like, you get to the point and you’re ready to capitalize on the opportunity given to you. And I kind of see sports as a big metaphor for that. 

Marcus: Absolutely. It takes a lot of work to be lucky, you know?

Courtney: Yeah. Right, to make those things that make you lucky.

Marcus: To be in a place where something can go, sure. 

Courtney: Absolutely. Obviously you loved it cuz you decided to do basketball professionally, like as a career. So talk a little bit about that process. 

Marcus: After I finished at Carolina, 2010, thought about, you know, trying to make a play for the NBA and was able to work out for the Charlotte Bobcats at the time.

Dana: What are they now? Hornets? hornets. That’s right, okay.

Marcus: I remember the night that the coaching staff came to my hotel room in Orlando. We were in Orlando before the summer league, before the NBA summer league, which is going on right now.   and they came to my door and they were like, you know, we’re not gonna be able to keep you on the summer league roster. We got XYZ player that we just drafted and   blah. 

I said, no problem. I completely understood. I didn’t think that I had a chance to make it on that roster anyway, specifically that roster. I mean, I saw all the guards that they had on, on the roster already. And it was that same night that my agent called and said, hey, we got an offer for you in Germany.

And I remember that phone call very vividly. I just said, okay, let’s try to get the most money that we can   and I’m ready to go. Really didn’t think much about it, and that was just kind of the first step that, that led to an 11-year career in Europe. So I played in, in eight different countries for 13 different teams.

Really just kind of bounced all over, but, but really had a phenomenal experience, one as a professional athlete, but two just as a, a world traveler yeah. Was able to travel to somewhere between 35 to, to 40 countries while I was playing and living in Europe over the last decade plus. And so just an experience that it’s kinda I mean extremely unique   and something that was very unexpected, but at the same time, just very, very grateful to have experienced that side of, of the possibilities  

There’s so many possibilities, you know, do you make it to the NBA? Do you play in the, in the development league or now the G league of the NBA? And do you go to Europe? Do you go to South America? Do you, I mean, there’s so many places to, to continue or do you just become a coach or a train?   I mean, there’s like so many ways basketball could have turned out for me.   and so I’m very grateful and thankful that it turned out the way they did.

Dana: Did you always know that basketball was your path or did you go into even school and major in something thinking, okay, well, this basketball just could be a fun hard four or five years, right? 

Marcus: No, I knew it was gonna be something that I was yeah gonna try to do after school. I actually remember I was with my brother last night and I hate to put him out here like this, but I remember my, my brother went to college to play basketball. And after his first year of playing at Pace University up in New York City   he decided he didn’t wanna play basketball anymore.. And now this was after hundreds and hundreds of AAU tournaments and basketball camps and traveling all over the country for tournaments and things like that.

And I just remember my mom not being super thrilled about it., you know, just, and again, you know, we, we were all in whatever place we were in at that time, but I could understand her frustration   and, you know, just kinda there’s so much that goes into. Getting to that level. And so I remember she looked at me, I think I was 12 or 13 years old and she was like, you need to make a decision now, right now, whether you’re gonna be, you know, this is something that you’re gonna be serious about now, if you wanna play high school basketball and try to get a scholarship.

Great, but just to be very intentional in our minds about how we’re gonna be spending our time and energy, for her, her money moving forward, you know,, going all over the place for all these things.,, you know, and training and all the things. So I remember from about 12 or 13 years old, I knew for sure that I wanted to do this professionally.

Dana: Yeah I agree. So my daughter plays basketball and she’s in sixth grade. Okay. So she, and I think in the years that she would’ve really, really kind of latched on was COVID so they didn’t have it and whatnot. And I, I bribed her to try out for the, the middle school team. I was like, I’ll pay you $20 just to try out   like, because I knew she would like it.

She was just convinced she wouldn’t, you know, she’s 12. And she did, and she made the team and wasn’t a huge accomplishment in a small school. So everyone who tried out made the team, but she really loved it and she really kind of latched onto it. And so we decided to put her in AAU just to kind of get her more game experience and yay use like full of scrappy people.

I mean, it is, yeah, it is intense, but it is expensive. And even putting her on that team, we. She was not up to snuff. And so we started getting her like one-on-one training, just trying to get her there cuz I didn’t play basketball. Okay. Although I probably should have cuz of my height, but I did not play basketball.

So I couldn’t tell her if her form was great or terrible. I just knew that you weren’t making it into the basket and I couldn’t tell you why I was not successful but I, I could totally see how as a parent and it’s not even just finances, but it is time. I mean it’s Saturday 8:00 AM and you’re not getting home till 10:00 PM And then all that, like it’s just is so overwhelming to see that die, but no pressure at 12. I know there’s a lot of pressure. 

Courtney: I know, like commit now, right now.

Dana: Yeah. It’s tough but was, did your brother ever regret it? 

Marcus: I don’t think so. He knew it wasn’t for him and I’ll, I gotta take my hat off to my brother. He’s always been somebody that’s really done what he wants to do. Whenever that switch flipped for him, you know, when he knew that it was time to, to do something else and put his energy somewhere else he did. You know? And so I feel like he never really spent any, or not too much time doing something that he didn’t wanna do, which I think is a great lesson to learn.

Yeah As a younger brother to, to, to see your older resident, you know, what, it’s time to pivot, it’s time to do something else. So, I don’t think he regretted, he stayed in basketball for a little bit.   became a coach and now he’s still. Helping other people and, and having been a big influence on the youth. So I, I think it all kind of works out for, for the right reasons. So 

Dana: I’m curious, I haven’t really talked to anybody that has been super successful in sports. Like I’m assuming you had a winning high school career   you had a winning college career, winning professional career. 

Marcus: Somewhat. 

Dana: Somewhat, okay. But how do you go from, to me? Cause I feel like that is such a, it’s a long period of time of being a winner. Like being either the best or always, you know, just being a winner and then coming back to what I would call real life almost   like, how did you transition that to get back and say like, okay, you’re done with this and you wanna move on onto the next thing. Was there like a time when it was just kind of like, I don’t know?

Courtney: I can imagine this would invoke all sorts of identity crises.

Marcus: Yeah. Well, I’m so glad you asked that question cause what a perfect time for that I am literally right in the middle of that today. It is a whirlwind of emotions, yeah rearranging my mind and even my body. And I mean, so many things   are, are happening in this transition from professional athletics to now, as you said, real life and as crazy and cliche as that sounds, it’s now been a year since I’ve played my last professional game, and it certainly does feel like a professional athlete is a fairytale. 

Yes, it’s a very difficult, difficult transition to your point. Basketball has been such an important part of my life and really kind of at the forefront of my life for 30, 31 of my 35 years on this earth.   so, yeah trying to move that to the side and allow something else to take up more space and more energy in my mind, it’s a tough transition for sure.

But it’s, it’s an exciting one. And I know that these moments of pain and discomfort are all about the, the growth and transformation, right?   we’re not gonna be the same person, our entire lives. We’re gonna, shed old things and, and, and gain new things and, and gain new experiences and, you know, leave things behind that, that, that don’t service anymore.

And it’s okay for things to have served us for a. Yeah, and then let go of him. And, you know, there doesn’t have to be any hard feelings about that and, and I’m not ready to, to leave basketball behind, per se, but, you know, it’s certainly taking a, a different form. Mm. In my life right now. So it is challenging.

It’s challenging to, to come from a, you know, a background of winning like that and, and to, to start a new career where you’re not winning right away, you know, that’s, that’s something that’s very difficult. 

Courtney: Most people don’t win right away and new careers 

Marcus: and nor did I win right away in basketball, right? I took time for that too. 

Dana: I’ve had this conversation with Ada my daughter, many, many a times, cuz she is athletic. She’s taller for her age, but she is just like, I don’t know, we call her the giraffe. 

Courtney: Like she she’s like a baby giraffe. I was about to say that she’s like, just she gallops, you know?

Dana: And she cares so much, like she is a perfectionist and whatnot, but I’ve, we’ve talked around many occasions. Like you can’t just rest on the fact of like your body, like of how you were born and what was given to you. Like there’s actual, like, you’re gonna hit a point when that’s not gonna be good enough, right?

Like for me, I played travel softball. Okay. And I wish someone told me, cuz I say now as, as an adult that I hit my peak when I was 16 and that was it. And I wasn’t meant to continue on to play like real competitive, like softball. I loved it. It was super fun. It was a very formative to my life. It taught me a ton of things, but.

You know, and I said, if you wanna get past that, what you call like, quote unquote, the peak you have got to put in the time, energy effort every single day. Like every single you need to basically have basketball in your hand every single day, cuz you’re not gonna get to these levels that you think you’re gonna get to by just resting on, I don’t know your DNA right. At the end of the day. 

Marcus: You’re absolutely right and that’s again, what a great lesson to be learned about all aspects of our lives, right? There’s nothing that’s just gonna happen to us You know; we really have to be out there. Putting time and energy yeah. Into things that we want to see happen. 

Dana: Yeah. But I think it’s hard when you’re moving against what, what you’re so good at. And you’re like, okay, now I have to find a new skill and maybe, maybe basketball always came easily. Not, you know, To because obviously you’re very tall., you’re very athletic. I 

Courtney: can’t tell that in this 

Dana: podcast, but he’s very tall.

you know, and, and it’s having to kind of figure out what, what are your other skills, what are the other things that you are good at? And I’m curious if there was something playing when you were playing that you said, okay, if I wasn’t gonna play anymore, I’ve learned this skill and this ability, and I would totally bring this into, you know, the next phase of my life. 

Marcus: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, again, I’m I make so many of these connections between sports and what we’re here now calling the real world, but it’s, it’s such a beautiful thing and that’s why I love sports. And I think Courtney to your point about watching college basketball or college athletics,, and at this point in your life feels a little different.

I, I feel like when you get older, you start to see some of those connect. much clearer. Mm. You, you see the teamwork, right?   you see the, the work, the work ethic.   to your point,, making sure that you’re putting in the time and, and, and working every day towards a goal. You have this teamwork aspect, you have this team culture aspect, right.

And so how do you cultivate team culture? How do you, how do you support your teammates? How do you encourage your teammates? Again, this is kind of the, the thing that I think about when I think about inspiring and empowering other people. Getting through adversity.     I mean, there’s gonna be ups and downs in, in sports.

And so dealing with losses, dealing with disappointments, how do you come back from those things?, leadership   I’ve always found myself in, in a leadership role on, on the teams that I’ve played for. And so being able to take some leadership qualities from athletics and, and bring that into life after basketball.

Um, I mean, there’s again, so many things that make you a successful athlete.   I think can make you a successful person off the court as well.   and so I think I’ve known for a very long time that, I mean, I knew I wasn’t gonna retire from playing basketball and never work again, you know, so, like I knew that there was gonna be a, a, a, a chapter of my life after basketball.

And I think that I’ve. done A great job over the last   several years of really trying to think about some of those things from this question, right? Like what do I take from basketball that can help me be successful off the court? And for me right now, as I start a new career that I’m not very experienced in and, or not experienced at all for that matter, not super knowledgeable yet.

Those are the types of skills that I have to hang my hat on right now the hard work   the working together with your teammates., you know, those types of things, the self-motivation, and even dealing with adversity Right now is a perfect example of adversity I wanna be good, but I’m not good.

I don’t know everything, but I wanna know everything. How do I deal with those tough moments? How do I deal with the moments where I have to say, I don’t know, or   yeah. Sorry, I can’t help you. Or, you know, all those things. They manifest in a very different way, but I think the underlying theme and, and, and, you know, fundamental ideas of them are very similar.

Dana: Yeah. I love that. I totally think so. 

Courtney:   even though you’ve obviously made like a 180, and we’ve done that in our   in our business, in our careers and things like that, as we’ve tried new things and had unsuccessful attempts and, all what worked with that. What didn’t work with that. And like, we’re gonna take those tools and do something different that I think that there’s something like you have a like up or something fundamental about being able to work hard for something, capitalize on an opportunity be successful, just like you would on the court that I think kind of knowing that you have the ability to do that, set you up for success in that next thing. Like I can work hard. I can capitalize on opportunity and I can go in and land it. You know,, when it is clutch   I think it’s key.

So I think you have like all of those, like that skill and that knowledge base that you can obviously then impart on other people as well., even though you feel like you’re starting at ground zero, you’re really starting at step two. Right?

Dana: I agree. I agree. 

Marcus: yeah, but that’s for me, why sports is so amazing?   yeah, because it really does teach you about life, all aspects. yeah. Your relationships business. I mean sure. Just there’s something to be learned for everything I think. 

Dana: Yeah  

Courtney: So what, so what are you working on now? 

Marcus: Let’s start with the most stressful   new house under construction.

Dana: Oh, that is stressful. Stressful. 

Courtney: We’re doing that too. 

Marcus: But what a blessing, a new job with, with Medalist Capital here in Raleigh   just got my North Carolina real estate brokers license, because our company. Working in financing of commercial real estate projects. We also just opened up an investment sales arm.

So that’s kind of where I’m working with, my company right now in a business development role, but also kind of leaning towards the investment sales team that we just started. So learning and trying to gain, as much experience as possible and knowledge as possible within the commercial real estate space.

So that’s something, I’m also getting super involved. The community back here in North Carolina that I’ve been away from for so long   getting more involved with the university and specifically with, athletics department, at the university, which is very, very awesome. I’m super thrilled about that. 

I’m also in the very early stages of writing a book. I have written a few pages And I have a lot more pages to go, but I’m super excited about that possibility. And   and, and that coming to fruition,, at some point here in the future   I think that’s, that sounds like enough. That’s a good bit for, for now. I think. 

Dana: What’s your book about like, what are you writing about?

Marcus: So I think that this kinda story of mine, this unique experience of athletics, one, my high school career, obviously the University of North Carolina, and so many people love Carolina athletics and Carolina basketball.

And so getting to hear a little bit more of a   in depth, kind of personal account of, of that experience and, and kind of what that meant to me. And then this idea of one, yes. Being a professional athlete, but two just kind of being all over the world.   and, and getting to travel the world and experience different cultures and, and people.

And a whole variety of, of experiences and kind of how that shaped me as a person and allowed me to look at life through a different lens And, and then again, this transition that we’re, you know, we’ve talked about and what was it like to, to transition? Not just from professional athletics to life after basketball   or life after sports, but just a complete 180, you know, maybe you’re a school teacher and now you’re gonna be a banker   or what I don’t know, you know, but just like, what do those adult transitions look like?

You know, and I think its transitions are tough when you do something for two years. when you’ve done something for 30 years and now you have to pivot, you know, what does that look like? And so, I just think that with all of those different things that have happened and all the, the ups and downs that I’ve experienced and, and some of the things that went very well and some of the things that went very poorly, I think that story can touch a lot of different people.

And I think there be a lot of different audiences that hopefully gain something positive From, from hearing, you know, my side of that story 

Dana: I’m sure, sure I, I can imagine traveling all over the world would definitely change like perspectives on lots of things. Is there any like, like really big thing that you learned either about yourself or even just the way you thought about another culture or something that just was like a big aha moment from traveling?

Marcus: Yeah. I think one of the things that I learned is that I’m super-fast pace all the time., which I think is something that we learned here in the us.   something that I certainly learned growing up in the DC area. 

Dana: That you personally, or super-fast pace?

Marcus: I mean, I think we can make a, somewhat of a broad generalization, which I don’t like to do, but just in general, yes. I feel like our pace of life here as Americans is super, super fast. I think we’re a little lopsided in our work life, family, relationship, integration. You know, I think that, I feel, 

Dana: I like that you, you say integration cuz balance is a bunch of bullshit. Cause there is no balance about it. 

Marcus:, I think we’re a little wobbly there But, and I think that COVID is changing the way that people think about that a little bit. I agree. And so like one of the, the big things for me after living in Europe, when I came home, I realized how much I was in my car. Mm that’s very terrible.   also realized how quickly and how uncomfortably, at least at times I feel like we eat lunch here in the us.

Yeah, that’s I mean, two hours for lunch was super normal when I was living in France and glass of wine at lunch is also super normal by the way., which I loved and so like 45-minute lunch or lunch at your desk, lunch in your car. That is like absolute blasphemy.

There’s no chance you’d ever see anybody eating in their car. I mean, yes, you would, but that is not normal at all. You know? So 

Dana: Do you come to any like epiphany as to why? Like what do you, what do you think, where is the value imbalance? Like. And, and I think for me, like when I hear it, I think like the reason why I probably work through lunch most days, or I eat in my car or we drive all over the place. I mean, we put over 20,000 miles on our car every single year   is because I’m like hustling the shit out of my business.

And I, and not that that’s a negative thing, but it always, and hearing that it’s like, well, it’s not like France isn’t successful and Germany isn’t successful. And you know, there’s people out there that are doing great at whatever they do. So where do you think that like, like what’s the value that’s missing?

Marcus: It’s, it’s very difficult to put your finger on it. I think. Especially as, as an athlete too, it’s like, I feel like on one side, what makes you a great athlete can make you great off the court?   but I also think that sometimes I feel like they’re very, like, they clash a lot.   right.

Like every day you gotta work.   and you gotta be doing something   you gotta be, you’re getting better or you’re getting worse. You gotta work super hard. When you go on vacation, how long do you go on vacation

Courtney: Try to go for a week. About a week? Yeah, a week. 

Marcus: Okay. Do you ever look at your email?

Courtney: Oh, absolutely. I bring my computer on vacation. 

Marcus: Okay. So let’s just go back to France. Shout out to everybody in France. I absolutely love France., two weeks is probably the shortest they would go on vacation.     three weeks is pretty typical. And when they’re on vacation, you’d have a 0% chance of catching them on email

Courtney: so maybe we have a very strange sense of self-importance. 

Marcus: It it’s just like, I don’t, I don’t know I don’t know what it is, but it’s so hard to just like put that away.   just be you where you are enjoy yourself. Like just totally let it go., you know, we have this idea that like, there’s something that we gotta do or something that we need to be doing, or if we, if we just do one little thing that it’s, I don’t know, it’s just, and that’s like that go, go, go, pace of life type of thing that I talked about earlier, you know, I. I just feel like we’re moving too fast. 

Dana: Right. But now, like when do you feel like, but do you feel like the consumers in France move slowly too? Like, and this might be a lie we tell ourselves, I don’t know, that we moved this fast because of the consumers of our product move that fast.

And I’m curious if you like, and I would assume that if, you know, it’s normal to take three weeks of vacation that, and maybe it’s someone who is in a service-based industry and they say, I’m going on vacation, that, that consumer who’s from France lives in France is like, oh, cool. I’m not gonna see or talk to you for three weeks because that’s normal.

And they’ve like almost trained the society to recognize the value of that, where we have not at all, like you could say you’re on vacation they’re like, oh, but you’re not going to like a third world country. I can still text you. And I’m like you can text me if you’re on the ledge. Right? Like if you’re about to jump, I will try to get you off the ledge, but like seriously, you know, but I don’t know. I don’t know if that’s just what it, if we, as a, and that’s just a vicious circle, like how do you change?   the way as a society. We, 

Courtney: but I wonder if it’s more about like being fully present, like if you’re fully present on vacation, are they also like fully present in their work environment? Like, so when they’re working, like they’re that’s all you’re doing, they’re working, right? Yeah. And when you’re home, that’s all you’re doing So maybe it’s a great ability to compartmentalize these aspects of your life maybe, cause like I’m never, I’m never 100% anywhere. No  

Marcus: Which is not good. Right? Yeah. But I, I think that that is probably more about. What’s going on there. Just presence. I love that. You said that. I think that’s a, a   such a beautiful concept that I think we can all be better at. 

Courtney: I love the concept, it’s hard and execution. 

Marcus: But that gets back to like the, the lunches too, you know, I’ll never forget one of the first times that I went to somebody’s house for, for lunch in France and we were there for three hours. We’re gonna enjoy this moment here together, however long it last.

And then you can go do whatever else you’re doing, you know? And so I think to your point, you know, just presence being fully present, wherever they are, vacation work home. and maybe that’s more about what it is, so yeah. 

Dana: So what are some things that you are hoping to do in your community? You mentioned that, that you wanna kind of get involved in the community. Are you talking more like youth sports or just like, what is, what, what is your vision like that you feel like you can give back to the community?

Marcus: So for a long time, just under 10 years, I had a basketball camp here in, in the us, in the DC area and here in North Carolina and most recently for the last four years or so, we started to do that camp for free. Mm. And, the last one that we did, I think we had just under a hundred kids, boys and girls, we brought in the.

It was kind of, we call it the community day. And so we brought in the police and fire department., we brought in Orange County sheriff and highway patrol, and just kinda wanted to, you know, we were working to start to get the hospitals involved. Didn’t quite get there, but we brought a lot of local businesses together as well. Some, some folks that offered some food to the campers and stuff and.

What we wanted to do, the idea was let’s create an opportunity for these kids who one may or may not be able to afford an $800 sleepaway camp at North Carolina or right. However much it is. and two, just to, to get around other folks in their community to see other people who, who serve their community and, and get them together with them and just see that there’s support for them.   in the community.   

so one thing that I’d love to mix sports with, you know, is this, this idea of community and support especially kind of in our local neighborhoods   and in our, in our local areas, unfortunately, I don’t feel like I have the time or the resources, even just personally, to continue to do this at a level that I’d like to. So that still opens up a little bit more space for me to try to find other ways, you know,. And so one of the things like I said is, is getting involved with, you know, UNC athletics, getting involved with the university as well.

Um, started helping out with habitat for humanity, a couple months ago and, and, a specific campaign that, that they have going on right now for, a mixed income community that they’re building in, in orange county.

So that’s been super exciting and fun and, and a great way to, I think, to, to try to give back to specifically orange county in an area they gave so much to me when I was here in school worked fairly closely with a table another non-profit in the area, in, in carbora, North Carolina, helping to, to, to fight hunger in orange county, in carbo and across North Carolina   so that’s been exciting as well.

Dana: you’re, just, just growing a bunch of stuff out there, trying to see what land sticks to like, find that. 

Marcus: And I think that it really doesn’t matter what you do, right.   just your, your how, and, and your why, you know,, like if you were. Out there I mean, leaving things better than   than when you found them, you know, and even if that’s just putting a little positive energy on something,, even if that’s just opening the door for somebody, telling them to have a nice day.

I mean, even things that simple can, can really create a ripple effect of, of positivity that you know, who, who knows what it turns up Yeah. Two years down the line, that could be a, a huge thing. Right, right. Like that, that could really, yeah. Snowball into something super big. So just trying, presence, right. Presence. Just trying to be present. 

Courtney: I love your confidence of putting this all out there Like I’m doing all this, all of this, trying all of this, knowing that some of those things are going to be unsuccessful. But I think that   I think that that’s. great.

Dana: Right? I mean, that’s kind of like how it is, you know, and that’s what I hope that most people, I hope it’s less my kids do Because I, I find it so hard and not to like, when your mom making you choose at 12, but I feel better being successful. but I feel that way about my kids. And they’re saying, they’re saying, okay, you’re turning 18.

Do you wanna go to college? Okay. Yes. What do you wanna major in or no, you don’t want to, like, what path do you wanna take, at 18 feels so overwhelming to make these lifelong decisions. And I love that your brother had the confidence to say, I tried this, I realized this isn’t the path I wanna go down.

And I love that you had the confidence at 12 to say, this is what I want. And it was what you wanted. And you were correct in that path. but I hope that whatever, the, whatever scenario, my kids land in that they feel like at any point they say, okay, like this exactly what you said, this has served me for a time has got me to where I am.

I’ve developed as a person. I, because of all of this, but then I wanna like just throw a wide net and just try to figure it out., and I, and I feel like what’s hard for me is I feel like I have a very straight path like this. Like I own a business and when I’m walking away from that, but I feel like there is definitely that’s decided, but the philanthropic side of me, that’s what I feel like I wanna do is just like throw this wide net, figure out what we wanna support.

Cause I feel like there’s so many things that I feel passionate about and I wanna help and, and I don’t feel like I can, or I know what or whatever, but I’m always afraid to take that step to say, you know, let me try this. Let me try to either. A nonprofit or start some community day or something and have it fail, you know, like there’s almost like this fear of failure with it because, because that’s something I care a lot about, but I love that.

It’s I don’t think it’s about that. It’s just about trying something and, and figuring it out. And, I don’t know, finding the stakeholders. That’ll do it with you too.   I. 

Courtney: Yeah. Well, I like how you mentioned more about your, how and your why, and like the success of it. Like, how are you gonna do it or why you’re gonna do it? It’s more than it’s gonna be the best thing ever, you know? Yeah. 

Marcus: Yeah. But it’s, it’s not easy to get over that fear though But, but you said it, you know, you care about it,, you know, it’s funny cuz my girlfriend says it to me all the time. If you’re afraid, then that means you care.

Yeah. So I think that that’s a good thing to, to, to recognize and to realize, but you know, you can still push through in the face of that.   and again, back to the boring sports analogies but like, that’s it, right? Like, you don’t wanna lose, you’re afraid of losing or you’re afraid of missing a shot, but there’s no chance you make the shot if you don’t shoot it. That’s right. So, you know, your kind of just gotta get going and, and, and try to try a lot of different things is no different than, than sports as well. You know, we’re gonna try this strategy, that didn’t work. We’re gonna try this.   this isn’t you. you just gotta figure out what works.

Yeah. And, you know, just kind, keep pushing  

Dana: Well, I love that. I feel like it’s like such great advice for life. Totally. In general, especially in the business world entrepreneurs, like, cuz there’s lots of failures. 

Courtney: Well, yeah. And there’s lots like behind the scenes failures Even those people who seem to like have all their shit together and it seems like it’s going well, then we do no, you don’t. You really don’t. 

Dana: Yeah There’s I’m just trying to figure it out. I know. I was trying to figure it out    

 We would love to end on knowing., two questions. One. Yes. What has been the most life changing moment in your career? And then two is where do you think you’ll be in the next five years? Like, what’s your dream? What’s your goal? 

Marcus: Honestly, I think that that conversation that I had with my agent back in July of 2010, I didn’t know what I was doing. I mean, I, I guess I did somewhere in my heart. I knew what I was doing, but I just told him sure, negotiate as much money as you can, and I’m ready to go to Germany.

Hmm. I just think that that leap of faith   and that step into the unknown and that kind of dive into life really yeah, that, that started me down the path that, that, that created a lot of good and bad, but, but a lot of things that I’m,, very, very grateful for, to have experience and growth and all the things that, that made me, who I am today really kinda started from that moment.

My dream for five years from now is to be in a, a place with my new career, where I feel more confident about the growth that I made. I know that in five years, I’m not gonna be at the peak of my career.. I will have had a great deal to look back on and say, okay, I’ve got to the checkpoints that I wanted to, I’m hitting my stride. I’m you know, picking up speed. So at that point that’d be great. In, in five years. 

I also would like to be helping maybe two times as many people as I feel like I’m helping now, if, if that’s a thing, you know, but just with the organizations that I’m involved with, some of the boards that I’m now getting involved with, like. Am I making, can I be making an impact on more people   right. So I, I would hope that in five years from now, I’m, I’m having more of a positive impact on even more people. Maybe that’s five people instead of two people    whatever it is. 

 I hate to say this all the time like this, but I just wanna be better. Not that where I am is not okay but just want to, you know, again, as an athlete, always just thinking can I do something better? Can I treat myself better?   can I treat other people better?, can I work harder? Can I rest   more intentionally, I mean, all, I mean, that’s part of better too.

 , so again, just, just trying to be more efficient and, and just be better. 

Dana: Well, I love that, cuz I think that’s a growth mindset and I think that people who have that growth mindset and I don’t know, I, I. You’re gonna be a lot farther along in five years than you think you will be. Is that yeah. Oh, thank you.

That, no, I do. I just, I think that you may or may not be in your house based on the Don climate right now, but seriously but yes, I, I love that. So, but thank you so much for spending your day with us I appreciate thank you for having it’s been great. Really enjoyed. It’s it. Wonderful to meet you.

Thank you. 

Thanks everyone for gathering us today to talk about the hustle. For our episode with Marcus, we are drinking an old fashion. We hope we get the chance to make it this week and cheers to diving into life. To learn more and connect with Marcus. You can visit him on Instagram at mgg1nyard with a 1 as an I, or visit his website marcusginyard.com 

Courtney: To learn more about our hustles, visit us on the gram at canddevents, at thebradfordnc, at anthem.house, and at hustleandgather. And if you’re interested in learning more about our speaking training or venue consulting, head to our website, hustleandgather.com.

Dana: And if you love us and you love this show, we’d be more than honored if you’d left us a rating and a review. 

Courtney: This podcast is a production of Earfluence. I’m Courtney 

Dana: and I’m Dana. 

Courtney: And we’ll talk with you next time on Hustle and Gather.